Building I beams: Kingpin vs TTB Ends

[philofab]

Is a kingpin end really that much stronger than a TTB balljoint end? I'm going to build another set of beams for my 2wd Bronco and I was wondering if I should just go kingpin... if so should I cut the snout off of the kingpin spindles and weld an aftermarker 2" snout on it for larger bearings/hubs? Should I just forget this stuff all together and build from scatch? I've had a few people tell me the TTB ends just wont hold up... whats everyones opinion on this? Thanks.

[Josh_K]

I have raced a few miles on TTB's and they hold up fine. The only part you have to remake is the spindle. I had 2 made form 300m. I raced a 5500 lb 8 truck and if I used the stock Dana 44 snout, I had to repace them every race. Once I replaced the snout, I could all but forget about the front end. I check it ever 3 races after that.

Sandy Cone makes a nice 5 lug hub for the 1 ton beam, but after its all said and done I think the ttb ends are easer to work with/weld on and are cheaper too. If your going to go the ttb route, call H&M and get the ball join blocks and build your beams for scratch.

[partybarge_pilot]

Strange, I've seen the center rip out of the cast knucle but I haven't seen a snout fail.

The TTB snout is stronger than the kingpin spindle pin buy a long shot. Bearings are also larger.

[1450-ranger]

If you are going TTB ends, use the d44 for sure. The d35's are a bit smaller, but the biggest difference is the spread between the bearings. The spread is very short and the leverage on the bearings and races is too much.

[Josh_K]

Strange, I've seen the center rip out of the cast knucle but I haven't seen a snout fail.

The TTB snout is stronger than the kingpin spindle pin buy a long shot. Bearings are also larger.

I have a snout that I totally snapped. I need to take a pic and post it. I was at Barstow testing and I hit the BIG whoops at the road crossing at about 60. The truck flaoted it well. It was the same spot a PBR took the vid a few months back. I proceded up the sandy road to the mud hills flat out. When I go the canyon I slowed to a walk to flip a 180 and head the other way. About half way around the 180 The right front felt like it dropped in a hole as the truck pivoted around it.

The snout was BRAND NEW. Not junk yard new but new new and it had about 10 miles on it before that. On Monday I called Dave G. for a pair of 300M snouts.

BTW, I have shatterd the nuckel too. But that was with the stock snout and it was fine. All you need to do is club a 5' rock square on with the tire at about 50 mph. The good thing is that the beam was fine.

[philofab]

Josh K: Who makes the 300m snouts? How much $$$? Bolt in replacement? What does the balljoint blocks look like? I like the idea of making the beams from scratch, Then I can cut, turn, and truss the beams to sell and make some extra $$$ to pay for this stuff.

1497: I planned on using D44 TTB stuff... I have three sets of them, one is originally from my Bronco. I don't think I've ever heard anything good about the D35 TTB.

[Josh_K]

[QUOTE=philofab;341460]Josh K: Who makes the 300m snouts? How much $$$? Bolt in replacement? What does the balljoint blocks look like? I like the idea of making the beams from scratch, Then I can cut, turn, and truss the beams to sell and make some extra $$$ to pay for this stuff.


His name on here is Dave_G. He and another guy named Wally own a company in Highland CA called Advanced Machine Dynamics.

They get busy at times and right now I think they are. There the machinest for the Herbts. If they cant help you, try Desert Specalties. I think they make the same thing.
And yes the snouts are a direct replacment for the stocker. What you will need to do with the old stock snout is to machine the shout off it and notch where needed and use it a backing plate on the nuckel. This basically sandwiches the cast iron nuckel between the plates.

The ball joint blocks are about 4" long and 2" wide and 1.25" tall. They have a radius on one end to round them out and there machined to recive the ball joint pin or caster/camber adjuster. The top block has a pinch bolt for the caster/camber adjuster. I think there just over a $150.00 for the set of 4 form mild steel and more $$$ for 4130.

[partybarge_pilot]

I have a snout that I totally snapped. I need to take a pic and post it.

Please do, I'd like to see where it broke.

[philofab]

Josh_K: Thanks for the info... those balljoint plates seem like a hell of a good deal.

[steveG]

Please do, I'd like to see where it broke.

Ditto.

Josh, why did you have to replaced the OE snouts after every race? Visible wear? Cracks?



The ball joint blocks are about 4" long and 2" wide and 1.25" tall. They have a radius on one end to round them out and there machined to recive the ball joint pin or caster/camber adjuster. The top block has a pinch bolt for the caster/camber adjuster. I think there just over a $150.00 for the set of 4 form mild steel and more $$$ for 4130.

Interesting... I'd like to see some pics of these. I've always wondered why I never see beam ends made with something like what you described instead of the huge heavy billet ends most use.

[DSPracing]

I had some beams from Mark's fab shop that were built that way. I always worried about strength but they were really well built and held up fine. Definitely a far more economical approach. The only downside was they had to be built as a j beam setup.

[Brandon_Charley]

You could always forego beam ends all together and go with a heims/uniballs. Camburg has a production setup that uses a unibal lower and a heim upper, pretty sure I've seen heims upper and lower.

[jeff]

TTT

Aloha