Ford TTB 4WD/Any other companies?

[jgbjgb]

A post, a PM, and an e-mail.

No response, no reply.

The post was posted on 23 Oct.....
The PM was sent 23 Oct.....
The e-mail was sent 25 Oct.....
It is now 29 Oct.....

It looks like Camburgs customer relations is as bad as Auto Fabs (see my Auto Fab?? NOT) thread. Which is interesting considering some wrote in that thread about small businesses not having the time to answer questions on the phone and how those same people suggested e-mail would be better. Well, I guess not. Which is also interesting knowing Camburg read that thread and knows that customer relations is important to me and that I will take my business elsewhere if I feel that it is lacking. To then blatantly ignore me shows extreme arrogance.

I do not care how many races Camburg has won, how many points they have or how much money, work, and time they have in their truck, what I care about is good quality parts, which by all accounts they offer, AND to be treated with some respect.


So, Auto Fabs out, Camburgs out, any other companies that offer long travel set-ups for a Ford TTB 4WD.....AND has good customer relations? Or are the two mutally exclusive?

[Jerry Zaiden]

I called you and left two messages... lol

What is your point here? I even sent you a pm to call me because your book of questions is much easier to explain over the phone. Just pick up the phone and call me 714 848 8880 lol

[steveG]

Jim, your posts are getting more and more disappointing. As consumers we have to be willing to do a little bit of work. I can't help but wonder what the receptionists side of the "Autofab NOT" story is. Granted you probably don't care, but these posts are doing nothing for your credibility.

Oh, and Jerry. You need to make yourself more available. Maybe you could post your cell #?

[baja619]

It sounds like you are having a battle of wits with your self and are losing

[Ryan B]

hmmmm... i went though kartek and got a set of camburg 4X4 beams.
so even with the middle man it only took like 3 weeks to recieve them.
pretty fast service!:)

[1450-ranger]

www.giantmotorsports.com

[Bulldozer]

http://www.desertrides.com/reference/suspension_kits.php

[Al Swearengen]

I called you and left two messages... lol

What is your point here? I even sent you a pm to call me because your book of questions is much easier to explain over the phone. Just pick up the phone and call me 714 848 8880 lol

Just like Jerry said, pick up the phone and give him a call. Jerry and staff at Camburg were never too busy to talk to me....maybe it's you ??? :confused:

[nobodyspecial]

Ok, this is slightly off topic (but not that much It concerns two companies mentioned :))

Could somebody explain the differences between Camburgs Performance off road system (coil sprung, cut and turned beams) and Autofabs 16" system?

I can see that the autofab kit uses custom coil buckets and such, but my main question is about the beams. are autofabs cut and turned as well? (I am sure they are) and why can autofab get 16" where Camburg gets 12"? My guess is from the custom coil buckets, mounted higher. am I right? can anyone clarify?

Thanks, Josh

[steveG]

Ok, this is slightly off topic (but not that much It concerns two companies mentioned :))

Could somebody explain the differences between Camburgs Performance off road system (coil sprung, cut and turned beams) and Autofabs 16" system?

I can see that the autofab kit uses custom coil buckets and such, but my main question is about the beams. are autofabs cut and turned as well? (I am sure they are) and why can autofab get 16" where Camburg gets 12"? My guess is from the custom coil buckets, mounted higher. am I right? can anyone clarify?

Thanks, Josh

The Camburg coil-bucket kit uses stock shock mounts. The shocks limit travel. Autofab has several shock mounting options for their custom coil-buckets that allow the use of longer shocks (typically a 14" travel in front of the bucket and a 10" behind).

[nobodyspecial]

The Camburg coil-bucket kit uses stock shock mounts. The shocks limit travel. Autofab has several shock mounting options for their custom coil-buckets that allow the use of longer shocks (typically a 14" travel in front of the bucket and a 10" behind).

Ahh, a dead thread lives!

Anyway, Has anybody taken, say... Camburgs cut and turned beams and switched from coils to coilovers? If so, what kind of travel numbers would we be looking at? would there be issues with the axles binding or anything?

What I was thinking is getting their cut and turned beams to get everything rolling and then upgrade to coilovers for more travel, and I am just wondering, how much more could you get with cut and turned beams and coilovers.

So, anybody done this?

[motoxscott]

Anyway, Has anybody taken, say... Camburgs cut and turned beams and switched from coils to coilovers?

Yes. I'm actually doing the same thing but I'm running coil springs on my extended/trussed beams with Bilstein 7100 remote shocks and will later do coilovers when I have the time to set it up the way I want.

Go out to a BITD pre-fun next year and you will see a ton of Broncos running modified only beams with coilovers. They arent trying to widen up the front end but want the added travel and adjustability that coilovers offer. It opens up valving, spring rates, spring lengths, etc. which you cant do with a standard coil spring setup.

Here are some pics of my bronco ... still a work in progress. Need to lower the ride height some since it has the nickname Grave Digger right now ... haha

- Scott @ Camburg

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd13/camburg/new.jpg
http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd13/camburg/new2.jpg
http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd13/camburg/front_on1.jpg

[nobodyspecial]

Thanks for the info Scott, those are some nice pics, and basically just what I want to do, but with your cut and turned beams. Got a rough guess on how many inches people are getting with your cut and turned beams and coilovers? (one other thing... you guys wouldnt happen to make an engine cage for mounting the coilovers like the one on Giants site, do you? :))

I just PMed Jerry a few minutes ago, I have decided to go with Camburg, but am leaving for a second tour to Iraq in January so my purchase is delayed. Just to let you guys know, My F150 is first on my list of things to do when I get back. you better have a set of those beams waiting for me! ;)

BITD? when I am in ND thats a little hard, but I am guessing I will be seeing more desert than most of the guys on this site in 2008. too bad I wont have my truck with me, but thats what HMMWVs are for. :)

[j10-401]

Nice Bronco, Looks Clean. Camburgs Beams Look Sick! Im Intrested In Ditching The Straight Axle And Installing Some Under An Old Jeep J10 Pickup.want More Travel But Keep The 4 Wheel Drive, Just Dont Know What Info Would Be Needed To Have Some Made. Any Input Would Be Great.

[Bulldozer]

Thanks for the info Scott, those are some nice pics, and basically just what I want to do, but with your cut and turned beams. Got a rough guess on how many inches people are getting with your cut and turned beams and coilovers? (one other thing... you guys wouldnt happen to make an engine cage for mounting the coilovers like the one on Giants site, do you? :))

I just PMed Jerry a few minutes ago, I have decided to go with Camburg, but am leaving for a second tour to Iraq in January so my purchase is delayed. Just to let you guys know, My F150 is first on my list of things to do when I get back. you better have a set of those beams waiting for me! ;)

BITD? when I am in ND thats a little hard, but I am guessing I will be seeing more desert than most of the guys on this site in 2008. too bad I wont have my truck with me, but thats what HMMWVs are for. :)

I don't know too much about TTB but I think about 15 inches or maybe a tad more is possible with cut/turned beams and coilovers.

[flyinbronco]

Hey Desertfox. Maybe you need to work on your people skills some. Why do you feel the need to bash companies on a public forum? You have zero class in my humble opinion.

[nobodyspecial]

I don't know too much about TTB but I think about 15 inches or maybe a tad more is possible with cut/turned beams and coilovers.

Thanks for the info. I wasnt expecting any numbers like equal length i beams or anything, I just figured I could get a few more than with coils.

[partybarge_pilot]

Thanks for the info. I wasnt expecting any numbers like equal length i beams or anything, I just figured I could get a few more than with coils.


My old Bronco would pull 16" with regular coils and new shock mounts. The coil isn't the limiting factor.

[nobodyspecial]

Yeah, steveG mentioned that its the shocks limiting travel, I was just grouping them together. Thanks for the tip, 16" would be good for my truck.

[jgbjgb]

joshdvirnak,

This is what I am doing on the front of my 96 Ford TTB:

Camburg cut and turned beams (not extended)
Camburg heimed extended radius arms
SAW dual rate coil overs

I am not planning on getting fiberglass fenders at this time, I am just going to have the wheel wells opened up a bit and see if this will work.

At this time I am running 1/2" spacers on my front tires with my existing Sky Jacker set-up. I may or may not run the spacers after the Camburg install, depends on if I still have tire rubbing issues on the radius arms.

The fab-up will be done by a reputable Off Road shop in northern UT in early January.

I will post my usable front travel numbers if you or anyone is interested.

---------------------------------------------------------------------

Good luck in your deployment and be safe.

I know what you mean about those HMMWV's, awesome vehicles. Some of the best off roading I have ever done was with military vehicles, wheeled and tracked.

[motoxscott]

Like others have said you're gonna see 14"-16" of wheel travel with a coilover depending on how you set it up and what shocks you're using. You want to keep everything in their working range so they are happy. The stock inverted Y steering isnt that great of a setup as it is, so you dont want to let it droop out too far even if the shock and spring will allow it because it will start to toe in the tire a lot and starts putting adding strain on the suspension and steering.

- Scott @ Camburg

[jgbjgb]

If the stock steering is not going to be optimal, what type of steering would you recommend?

I had thought about doing this:

www.superlift.com/library/ford/83-TTB-4.html

But SteveG said it would not work. And since he and others have more experience and knowledge than I do about this I am trying to follow his and others advice and recommendations.


Stay away. The Supperrunner steering kit was designed for big-lift street cruisers with lowered pivot points. If I'm not mistaken it's designed for 6" lower pivots. For a desert-style front end, stock steering (in good condition of course) is better. Cross-over would be the best steering system but certainly not necessary with a stock width TTB.

[partybarge_pilot]

If the stock steering is not going to be optimal, what type of steering would you recommend?

I had thought about doing this:

www.superlift.com/library/ford/83-TTB-4.html (http://www.superlift.com/library/ford/83-TTB-4.html)

But SteveG said it would not work. And since he and others have more experience and knowledge than I do about this I am trying to follow his and others advice and recommendations.

That will still have massive bumpsteer issues. A single swinger set-up is about the best bang for the buck.

[jgbjgb]

I found this at Threat Motor Sports, is this what you are talking about:


CROSSOVER STEERING KITS

Complete Kit Includes:
- Swing Set Steering
- All mounting brackets
- Eight 7/8" hiems
- Bushing kit
- Bungs, misalignment spacers, and jam nuts
- Grade 8 hardware (add $10 for F-911)
PRICE: $1,800

[Bulldozer]

I found this at Threat Motor Sports, is this what you are talking about:


CROSSOVER STEERING KITS

Complete Kit Includes:
- Swing Set Steering
- All mounting brackets
- Eight 7/8" hiems
- Bushing kit
- Bungs, misalignment spacers, and jam nuts
- Grade 8 hardware (add $10 for F-911)
PRICE: $1,800

Not quite, that is double swinger setup. A single swinger isn't nearly as expensive.

[1450-ranger]

Not quite, that is double swinger setup. A single swinger isn't nearly as expensive.

You do not need a double swinger system to get the steering right on an extended, non-equal length 4wd or 2wd system. That Threat kit is designed for his 2wd equal length ranger kit.

[steveG]

I found this at Threat Motor Sports, is this what you are talking about:

CROSSOVER STEERING KITS

Complete Kit Includes:
- Swing Set Steering
- All mounting brackets
- Eight 7/8" hiems
- Bushing kit
- Bungs, misalignment spacers, and jam nuts
- Grade 8 hardware (add $10 for F-911)
PRICE: $1,800

Yes, that's cross-over steering kit but I think it's for a Ranger.

Here is the single swinger steering kit on Rick's (flyinbronco on RDC) Bronco:

http://www.autofab.com/Ricks%20bronco%201.jpg

Keep in mind that there are a lot of stock width TTB/TIB trucks out there with tons of desert miles on them and stock steering. It may not be optimal but it still gets the job done. Some swear that the stock steering is crap, but I've beat the hell out of my TTB Explorer, TIB Ranger and TTB Bronco, all with stock steering and have not had a single tie-rod problem.

Look up Chris_Wilson's posts. He and his dad have some of the most-used Broncos out there and last I heard they were still on stock steering. I do believe, however, they upgraded to the heavier 3/4 ton tie rods. I may eventually do the same.

As far as I know, Camburg doesn't have any steering options for the TTB, so any steering upgrade would have to build a custom build according to the beam and radius arm pivots.

[Bulldozer]

You do not need a double swinger system to get the steering right on an extended, non-equal length 4wd or 2wd system. That Threat kit is designed for his 2wd equal length ranger kit.

That is correct. Kinda the point i was getting at but I didn't elaborate much.

[motoxscott]

The stock steering works and can see a ton of use, but my point was not to be so focused on just travel numbers. Look at the big picture and all the components. If you keep the steering in its working range it will work fine until you go past that point than it will be time to upgrade.

Mark @ Southwest Performance (858) 449-2292 who worked at H&M in years past has been building a ton of "real" broncos lately and has developed a single swing steering kit for them. That is what Im planning to use on mine, no point re-inventing the wheel I have enough on my plate as it is .. haha Don't buy any of those weld it yourself or generic swinger steering kits, buy something or have something built specific for your truck and beam configuration or why even do it at all if its not gonna be right.

Really it comes down to how far you want to take your project and how much $$$ you want to throw at it.