Race engine break-in.

[Ziggy]

Any tips for breaking in a race engine?

[bajaruner11]

What type of engine are you breaking in?
Is it from scratch new?
Does it have a flat tappet cam, or a roller?

[Ziggy]

What type of engine are you breaking in?
Is it from scratch new?
Does it have a flat tappet cam, or a roller?


351 stroked to 408
its a real race engine with flat tappet cam.
morgans machine in walnut creek built it

[scottm]

How racy is it? You should check with your builder, but full race flat tappet cams are the most critical for proper break in. Comp Cams recommends running a single valve spring or extra low lift rocker arms to reduce pressure on the cam and lifters during break in. Also street oils as of 2007 all lack the amount of zinc and phosphorous (ZDDP) needed for proper break in of flat tappet race cams. The epa required reduced levels starting with MJ grade oils to prolong the life of catalytic converters, as if 150K miles isnt enough... In fact now no street oil is good enough for porsche air cooled engines any more, not even mobile 1. There are several good petrolum oils specifically for break in, but the only one I can think of is sold by Joe Gibbs Racing. Your best bet is to use a petrolium street oil with an additive. I use a ZDDP additive from Torco, but its hard to find. GM sells a zddp additive you can get at any chevy/gm dealer, called strangely enough, 'break in additive'. After its broken in, set your idle at 1000 rpm to maintain proper lubrication, then run race oils or additive forever after. If anyone is interested, I can post a link monday to more info on the imprtance of zddp.

[Ziggy]

How racy is it? You should check with your builder, but full race flat tappet cams are the most critical for proper break in. Comp Cams recommends running a single valve spring or extra low lift rocker arms to reduce pressure on the cam and lifters during break in. Also street oils as of 2007 all lack the amount of zinc and phosphorous (ZDDP) needed for proper break in of flat tappet race cams. The epa required reduced levels starting with MJ grade oils to prolong the life of catalytic converters, as if 150K miles isnt enough... In fact now no street oil is good enough for porsche air cooled engines any more, not even mobile 1. There are several good petrolum oils specifically for break in, but the only one I can think of is sold by Joe Gibbs Racing. Your best bet is to use a petrolium street oil with an additive. I use a ZDDP additive from Torco, but its hard to find. GM sells a zddp additive you can get at any chevy/gm dealer, called strangely enough, 'break in additive'. After its broken in, set your idle at 1000 rpm to maintain proper lubrication, then run race oils or additive forever after. If anyone is interested, I can post a link monday to more info on the imprtance of zddp.


I'm impressed.You know your stuff.The guy that built my engine is a full race shop and its all race engine.He is a metalurgist by trade and then an engineer.The first thing he mentioned was the lack of zinc.I have to use different retainers for break-in and then replace them when its done.He also want me to use a product to "coat "the inside of the motor which goes in the coolant.

[Dezertpilot]

I used to think that their was an engine break in time period. But after having a conversation with my buddy regarding out 2008 KTM 530 EXCR's Im starting to think their isnt one. When an engine is built then taken directly to a dyno they do mild pulls for 30 minutes or so. Then they go all out and rape the engine. So I think engine break-in is more old school thinking? Someone please correct me if I am wrong.

[bajaruner11]

Good and correct info regarding engine oils and flat tappet cams, follow it.
There are a few oils out there formulated for break in purposes, I use Brad Penn,
that's the good old Kendall Green oil just under a new name.
They make a 30w break in oil formulated with high levels of ZDDP just
for the purpose of flat tappet camshaft break in.
The only other critical thing an engine goes through during break in is seating of the piston rings,
they need a positive and negative load placed on them to seat correctly.
Put a load on the engine that simulates pulling up a steep hill, then decelerate allowing the
engine to slow the car as if your coming into a corner.
Do this about 5 times bringing the rpm up to around 4000 then back down to a fast idle,
the rings should be seated after that. Your not look for a high RPM free rev situation,
that just causes ring float which can cause the rings to rotate, and the gaps to line up.
Really to keep a full race engine alive you need to keep it on a healthy diet of race oil, many
choices out there, but I have found racing synthetic oils to be the best. Choice is yours, but talk to your
builder.

[clogking]

I am interested to know didn't the engine builder have a recommendation? Most builders brake them in on a dyno. All mine do. This is how we did it in the shop back in the day(flat rating) for stock motors.
First make sure the cooling system is perfect!!! and all levels are right. Start the motor get it up to about 1800 to 2000 set the timing(total) ASAP!!! and let it go for 10 to 15 minutes varying the rpms 1800-2000. Keep a close eye on all temps.I think for the most part cams are better and harder than in the past.
Good luck......

[YZBrad]

How racy is it? You should check with your builder, but full race flat tappet cams are the most critical for proper break in. Comp Cams recommends running a single valve spring or extra low lift rocker arms to reduce pressure on the cam and lifters during break in. Also street oils as of 2007 all lack the amount of zinc and phosphorous (ZDDP) needed for proper break in of flat tappet race cams. The epa required reduced levels starting with MJ grade oils to prolong the life of catalytic converters, as if 150K miles isnt enough... In fact now no street oil is good enough for porsche air cooled engines any more, not even mobile 1. There are several good petrolum oils specifically for break in, but the only one I can think of is sold by Joe Gibbs Racing. Your best bet is to use a petrolium street oil with an additive. I use a ZDDP additive from Torco, but its hard to find. GM sells a zddp additive you can get at any chevy/gm dealer, called strangely enough, 'break in additive'. After its broken in, set your idle at 1000 rpm to maintain proper lubrication, then run race oils or additive forever after. If anyone is interested, I can post a link monday to more info on the imprtance of zddp.

Very good advice. A friend of mine flattened a cam breaking in his race engine with regular motor oil.

Dont take my word for it, but doesnt the Shell Rotella diesel oil have the zinc phosphorus in it?

[JEFFRPM]

The shell rotella and chevron delo 400 still has zinc in it. BUT it is reduced amount only 800 PPM the old oils had 1800PPM. I don't think i would break in a flat tappet cam with this stuff but i still run it in everything i own with a flat tappet cam.

[Ziggy]

I am interested to know didn't the engine builder have a recommendation? Most builders brake them in on a dyno. All mine do. This is how we did it in the shop back in the day(flat rating) for stock motors.
First make sure the cooling system is perfect!!! and all levels are right. Start the motor get it up to about 1800 to 2000 set the timing(total) ASAP!!! and let it go for 10 to 15 minutes varying the rpms 1800-2000. Keep a close eye on all temps.I think for the most part cams are better and harder than in the past.
Good luck......

Looks like thats where we are going with this.I asked him to break it in and he said he did not have time as he builds all the drag engines for the big drag teams.He literally has 150 engines on the floor at any time.
I whined a little and he has agreed to break it in.
Thanks

[scottm]

Here is a porsche site with a ton of good info on oil quality:

http://www.lnengineering.com/oil.html

And here is an additive:

http://www.zddplus.com/

[Wendell #1303]

European Motorsports in Hawthorne gave me break-in directions for my Type IV motor. They sold me some Brad Penn break in oil to use, they said to get it up to 2500 RPM and leave it steady there for 20 minutes. Then run it up and down the RPM and load range before changing oil to regular racing oil. They said it wouldn't really be broken in till about 500 miles, but I didn't have to use the break in oil for all that time.

[Ziggy]

You guys are awesome.

[tsho123]

I think breaking in a KTM dirtbike engine that is stock and built to last is quite a bit different than breaking in the engine that Ziggy has. With my 600 engine we would throw it straight on the dyno up to 15k RPM right after rebuild, BUT we rebuilt after every race and it's a inline 4 bike engine...If the guy has 150 engines in his shop, I'm sure he's broken in a few, good idea on whining...

[vierzwanzig]

awesome info guys.

[philofab]

I won't build an engine with a flat tappet anymore... roller only. It's worth it. I just did a 351M that had a Comp Cam go flat on one lobe because of a faulty lifter. It has a Comp roller in it now. Comp cams did treat me well, good customer service.

[philofab]

The "Bob is the oil guy" website has some really good info. I use Rotella T in all my gas engines.

[John F2000]

I used to think that their was an engine break in time period. But after having a conversation with my buddy regarding out 2008 KTM 530 EXCR's Im starting to think their isnt one. When an engine is built then taken directly to a dyno they do mild pulls for 30 minutes or so. Then they go all out and rape the engine. So I think engine break-in is more old school thinking? Someone please correct me if I am wrong.

Initial break in on a new motor is different than the recommended break in time you might be referring to. The initial start and hold at a specific rpm without cycling the power is to break in the cam.