Now that HDRA show has aired...Opinions??

[Double Down]

I am loving this concept, and would love to help it along. I dont wanna cheapen racing however, I would love to bring some outside interest and rope some big deal outsider type into our fold...but not just anyone. Somebody worthy of the invitation. Someone who would take it seriously... Start brainstorming... I am willing to do some legwork on this...

We have the resources in place to make this happen at anytime!!! We could do a dozen arrive and drive race cars in each race. We just need the drivers, co-drivers and sponsors. That's all

[SPONSOR]

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[Ol' Curmudgeon]

...The 70’s like your career has long since passed...

You obviously haven't been reading all the posts, that was one of my main points, that today's media world is ever-evolving.

You obviously don't understand my "short-hand," no need for you to really, as my comments were never directed towards you.

I note you and others have come to Roger's so-called defense, but from this poster's perspective, it comes off as a hijack by a bunch of overwrought, overly-emotional, fan boys.

I don't race anymore, I don't need to solicit any sponsorship, I don't need for my comments to be approved by the hoi polloi.

I probably should have just reported all your posts as harrassing, rather than replying, but didn't want to give the mods a bunch of work, so here we are. I see "DoubleDown" had the last post as I opened this thread tonight, I'll get there after I wade thru your mud.

Please feel free to put me on your ignore list.

Thanks for playing!

Now run along, kiddie, you bother me.

[Ol' Curmudgeon]

Having been to almost every Plaster City race in the past 15 years I can tell you that the HDRA race was the biggest event to happen there in that time frame. Also one of the safest and well organized races I've ever attended. Take that info from someone who attends 35+ races a year.

Also the El Centro Chamber of Commerce was very happy with the turn out and many local businesses profited from the event. Many of the businesses near contingency experienced their biggest sales to date. I know this because I sit on the off-road committee for the Chamber.

HDRA is on the right path.

Thanks for the info and constructive reply!

You ARE an ACE!

[Double Down]

True however, NASCAR finds a way to work around it so we should be able to also.

If a racer is unsponsored they really need to build their own brand image and that means putting their name loud and proud across the visor and a big ol numbers on their doors, hood and or roof. the fancy flame paint job and logos that ya cant read forom 30 feet away need to take a back set. on the ground at races its easy to see who runs what logos but with the added opportunity of this type of media coverage makes available, its time to step up and some people need to take their vehicle graphics way more seriously.

In skateboarding, riders are paid if they get coverage. If you get the magazine cover you get a check. (its called photo incentive) Along with these incentives there are requirements. An example is a guy getting the cover of a big magazine is great and helps his career however his sponsors dont really see any return on investment if their logos are not prominently displayed in the pic so, the riders work that out by making sure they are wearing the right shirt and have their stickers on the boards where they will make the shot. A cover shot with a 4 inch logo in it pays way better than one with a tiny logo in it.

RobDyrdek, pro skater is the king of this and does it on TV. look at this picture of his office...


companies he represents.. monster, DC shoes, alien workshop, wild grinders (his toy company) and street dreams (a movie he made) are all represented. this is not by accident, it is by design.

Since many teams are self sponsored and write off some of their racing expenses by using there race car as an advertising tool they have a tendency to do a big lo wrap with "SO and SO construction" on the car. But they are sill self sponsored. And I dunno how many peeps go and use that construction company for their needs because they saw the car but, it bet its not many. I am pretty sure that if they reduced the prominence of their self sponsored logo (or random team name) and but a big number on the door and their name, they would generate interest in the car just as well BUT, it would draw the attention to the cars driver to and help his fame.

before i go further let me say i am about to make some general assumptions about teams and their sponsors or self sponsorship. my facts may be a bit off but they are still correct in concept...

As an example, i will use andy mac. he and his family are in real estate/construction and you look at his TT and see a big M on it and Identify it that way. Now considering the truck is funded by his family's business (right?) its basically self funded, and regardless of how much coverage he gets in magazines i really doubt it brings the fam much return. Have any of you bought a Mc home because you like andys skills? Not likely? But, lets say he was picked up By DC shoes... his hat at the finish, his fire suit,and truck etc would be plastered with DC logos BIG ONES...and DC would reward him for this. His team would likely still need their own money to race but they opened a whole new revenue stream also. they just gotta run a smaller M on the truck.

Some teams do it right. While i miss the big red herbst trucks and think seeing them all black is still kinda odd, i like how they were able to get a deal with monster and made the graphic change to fund their racing...BJ baldwin has taken the monster marketing to the next level, green wheels and frame, mini logos all over the interior etc. People who dont care about racing can identify Ken Block and his sponsors with ease.

HDRA used a ton of everyones go pro footage for this show. Any while I enjoyed it I also noticed that there were no logos in hardly any of it. A camera in the cab facing forward would show the inside of the visor and the top of the dash. At one point the guy doing the voice over directed your attention to the speed on the GPS screen. But, nobody took advantage of these advertising opportunities. There was no sticker that said "buy (insert name here) ". This was a easy opportunity to get some tv time for sponsors and keep them on the hook for next year.

Nascar knows how to do this... look at these pics... see any logos?




even if you totally suck at racing but happen to be there with a rear facing or in cab go pro running when something awesome happens and you get it on camera, its of great use to HDRA but of no use to you or your sponsors. BUt if you were able to put a logo on the truck thats in the footage (strategically placed to compliment the the camera shot) when you get passed. HDRa might use that shot to tell the story about the guy who passed you and then, even though you arent part of the story, your logo is still in the shot and thats a good thing.

Roger I am sure will back me up on this. He wants to bring in sponsors outside of our industry into it to sponsor stuff. Wouldnt it be cool to race the t-mobil reno 500, or the coke a cola redline at stateline,where there was so much outside the industry sponsorship involved in the event that the entry fee was almost nothing? Hes also given all you guys the opportunity, for free, to capitalize on television coverage and represent your sponsors and for the most part, you guys failed.

The only logos I remember were HDRA, and the f and L buggy brady drove. And of course there was me and the SDHQ chase truck with a four foot logo on the side of it. we did retrieval and our shop had more media coverage when we rolled the big fish bug back over than some of you guys who won your classes and we werent even racing. how dumb is that?

Anyway, enough with my rant, I just worked as a guy who sponsored athletes for a huge part of my life and I shake my head when i see opportunities like this missed.

Oh and tell Brandon Arthur to call me. This kid as rad, and him and his big yellow beast stole the show and I want my shops logos on that thing!

And the show was great. It felt very real to watch it. I think viewers will like that they can identify with the racers and that it will result in bringing the sport closer to what it can be and more than what it is now. Well done HDRA. ANd thank you for making this happen.

Hey Dan,

You are right on with your points. I hope everyone is paying attention to the posts in this blog because there are some very good points that have been made. The guys who are paying attention will be benefit big time. I will be seeing Brandon Arthur tomorrow night and I will let him know about the sponsorship opportunity with your company. Anyone who would like to join us tomorrow night at Bulls Eye Burger & Brew is welcome. We will be showing the national premiere of the Imperial 250 race. Party starts at 5pm.

[dan200]

Hey Dan,

You are right on with your points. I hope everyone is paying attention to the posts in this blog because there are some very good points that have been made. The guys who are paying attention will be benefit big time. I will be seeing Brandon Arthur tomorrow night and I will let him know about the sponsorship opportunity with your company. Anyone who would like to join us tomorrow night at Bulls Eye Burger & Brew is welcome. We will be showing the national premiere of the Imperial 250 race. Party starts at 5pm.

Thanks Roger. Brandon's father have already spoken and and we are in the beginning stages of working out a mutually beneficial arrangement. That kid can wheel a truck and with the right mentoring and sponsors/funding I see him as someone who has a bright future in racing. I am really excited about this stuff and hope we can set something up to help his program. I hope you will put in a good word for me.

Thanks for the help and I will see you in Reno.

[Ol' Curmudgeon]

Roger:

Now that I've waded thru the mud, or silt, or whatever that **** was, and we've had some anecdotal evidence that attendance was higher than at past non-HDRA events of a similar nature in/near Plaster City, I have more questions:

1. No need to reveal your budget, but where were your media buys for the commercials? Local broadcast? Cable? San Diego? LA?

2. Did you buy ROS or target specific audiences and programs?

3. Was any sort of control included for variables such as weather, competing events, economic conditions, etc.?

4. Was any sort of survey done asking attendees where and how they had become aware of the event?

5. Were any attempts made to get an accurate count of attendees? (We know this is difficult. Estimating is even worse.
The Washington, DC, PD has trouble making accurate estimates, and it's had decades of practice.)

6. What other advertising of the event was done, like radio, print, poster or internet post? Where was such presented?

7. What promotional/advertising efforts were expended by previous promoters towards reaching the general public?

Sorry about the interruptions, but, the kids, well you know...



As for those touting the celebrity angle: how many of those mentioned are contractully obligated NOT to engage in dangerous activities like motorsports, even if their main careers are in motorsports?

I would posit the vast majority.

Nissan fielded celebrity drivers like Chuck Norris and Ted Nugent back in the day, circa early 80's. Seemed to make some impact among off road racing afficianados, but not so much among the general public.

And again, that was in a time with far fewer entertainment choices readily available to most consumers.

[J Prich]

You sir obviously have a significant amount of experience and background in these matters, and have almost completely dismissed just about every suggestion proposed to this point. In your opinion, what CAN be done, or is this quest for sponsorship/exposure a lost cause?

[AZ45]

Roger:

Now that I've waded thru the mud, or silt, or whatever that **** was, and we've had some anecdotal evidence that attendance was higher than at past non-HDRA events of a similar nature in/near Plaster City, I have more questions:

1. No need to reveal your budget, but where were your media buys for the commercials? Local broadcast? Cable? San Diego? LA?

2. Did you buy ROS or target specific audiences and programs?

3. Was any sort of control included for variables such as weather, competing events, economic conditions, etc.?

4. Was any sort of survey done asking attendees where and how they had become aware of the event?

5. Were any attempts made to get an accurate count of attendees? (We know this is difficult. Estimating is even worse.
The Washington, DC, PD has trouble making accurate estimates, and it's had decades of practice.)

6. What other advertising of the event was done, like radio, print, poster or internet post? Where was such presented?

7. What promotional/advertising efforts were expended by previous promoters towards reaching the general public?

Sorry about the interruptions, but, the kids, well you know...



As for those touting the celebrity angle: how many of those mentioned are contractully obligated NOT to engage in dangerous activities like motorsports, even if their main careers are in motorsports?

I would posit the vast majority.

Nissan fielded celebrity drivers like Chuck Norris and Ted Nugent back in the day, circa early 80's. Seemed to make some impact among off road racing afficianados, but not so much among the general public.

And again, that was in a time with far fewer entertainment choices readily available to most consumers.

Buying advertising in El Centro is different than buying in a major market. In smaller towns, there are other mediums that are probably more effective, but a cable rotater in Imperial Valley is probably worth about 20 bucks a spot and I bet radio is half that. There's not really a need for all of the extra data gathering, it would cost you more than the advertising. This is a desert race and the audience is pretty narrow, its shooting fish in a barrel.

Co-promoting with the local moto and car shops would probably be effective too. I bet the Coynes have a handle on the media market and may get treated better than non-traditional advertisers.

Having celebs drive at the races is a great idea, you just need to figure out how its going to help you. How are you going to leverage the exposure? RG raced NORRA and the Palens were there with Walker, I'm sure it will be in my marketing proposal next year because of the name recognition.

The advertising wont get more racers entered, but it makes the side show better which is as effective marketing tool for the racers seeking sponsorship. I think the numbers your asking for would not impress potential sponsors, but the images of the 'show" likely would.

I remember asking my dad for sponsorship money to race when I was in HS, his question to me was "Who's going to see you in the middle of the desert?" The answer is nobody, so you have to get in front of the money somewhere else.

There's money and exposure is outside the track at major events, you just need to find it.

Another saying from FU(Furrier University) that I heard MANY times growing up" Your money is their pockets".

[Ol' Curmudgeon]

You sir obviously have a significant amount of experience and background in these matters, and have almost completely dismissed just about every suggestion proposed to this point. In your opinion, what CAN be done, or is this quest for sponsorship/exposure a lost cause?

You reading what I'm writing? RDC has been acting weird and creaky lately, but I don't see what you do. Please send me the post #'s* of where you think I dismissed any suggestions (besides a suggested retail price for the DVDs, which I actually did not dismiss, but thought was too high for less-than-rabid fans or those seeking to use the DVD as a marketing tool) regarding the promotion or advertising of HDRA races or video productions, which are what I perceive the thread is about.

*via VM please, I would suggest to all to do that rather than keep derailing this thread with their impatience, impudence, inappropriate or harassing posts. You know who you are.
Thanks!

[J Prich]

You reading what I'm writing? RDC has been acting weird and creaky lately, but I don't see what you do. Please send me the post #'s* of where you think I dismissed any suggestions (besides a suggested retail price for the DVDs, which I actually did not dismiss, but thought was too high for less-than-rabid fans or those seeking to use the DVD as a marketing tool) regarding the promotion or advertising of HDRA races or video productions, which are what I perceive the thread is about.

*via VM please, I would suggest to all to do that rather than keep derailing this thread with their impatience, impudence, inappropriate or harassing posts. You know who you are.
Thanks!

Interestingly enough I actually did read what you wrote. For whatever reason you seem more interested in an argument than a fair discussion but perhaps that's just the nature of the internet. I'm asking you an honest question and maybe you are predisposed to be defensive because of the manner in which some have responded. I'll gladly cite Post #166 in which you suggested that contractual obligations, past history, and the broader range of available media options would potentially prevent the introduction of celebrity involvement from being fruitful. I'm not twisting your words, you actually wrote that and I'm not attempting to argue that point but simply point out that you absolutely have dismissed some of the ideas floated here.

So that said, again I'm just curious to know what kind of positive things do you think can/need to be done that could have the desired affect of more reach and therefore more sponsor involvement? Or are you of the opinion that things are what they are?