1. Forum membership has its advantages....

Desert Racer vs. Rock Racer @ KOH

Discussion in 'Rockcrawling' started by Rock Donkey, Feb 12, 2012.

  1. Rock Donkey

    Rock Donkey Member

    Joined:
    Sep 2, 2008
    Location:
    Phoenix, AZ
    Five years of racing King of the Hammer's and I've yet to see a Desert Racer get close to winning the hardest one-day off-road race in the USA. Not even a top ten spot yet if I'm not mistaken. Even the moto event saw Desert Racer's jump out front at the beginning but the talented Rock Racers won in the end, just like in the 4-wheeled event.

    The Rock Racer's have success when they jump into Desert Races.....which begs the question: How long will it take for a desert racer to be in the hunt for a win? 5 years? 10 years? Never?
     
  2. Poisonous

    Poisonous Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2010
    Location:
    Redlands, CA
    I call TJ finishing well next year. From what I've seen, he's dedicated more time to learning the rocks than any desert crossover.
     
  3. BRINGTHERUCKUS

    BRINGTHERUCKUS Nimrod de PMC

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2005
    Location:
    Parker/Tucson, Arizona
    RG had a good shot. I was talking to him in our shop the week before and he had been putting in time. RG plays to win. Im still no a rock fan.. lol has to do with my phobia of hills....
     
  4. LCOwner

    LCOwner New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2010
    Location:
    Madera, Ca
    Not trying to pick a fight but could it be that the Desert Racer just hasn't taken the Rock Crawler/Racer seriously until now. Rock donkey's getting some coverage.
     
  5. rockstacker

    rockstacker Member

    Joined:
    Nov 17, 2005
    Location:
    Rifle, colorado
    I have ben working with Desert and rock teams for 10 years now from fabrication to pit management even driving from time to time. The one thing that has brought all the desert racers that have tried KOH down is running new cars with NO test time and pre-running in their race cars, or in this years case a proven car with a dead motor. I watched RG go through the rocks. If his car had the power that RG needed/wanted and been able to sustain he would easily made the top 5. KOH is TRUE off road racing. Desert races are completed by a majority of 2wd vehicles on courses that a stock bug can get through. You cant make it to RM 10 in KOH with out some Badass 4wd. You dust junkies better pay attention Rock racing is the new desert racing. The vehicle and driver have to be competitent in two different fields that require VERY different elements to accomplish a far broader spectrum than traditional desert racing. We haven't even shown you dust boys the HUGE WALLS we shoot or jump off of. You think there are "Technical sections in the rocks this year??, NOT...it gets MUCH worse. Back door is a mere bump only 8 feet high. Some of the walls we regularly shoot in Moab and farmington are 30-40 feet high and just as steep. As the teams become more compitent and the vehicles start to reach the engineering level of Trophy Trucks (And they are aproaching that level very quickly) the course will just get harder, A LOT HARDER. RG, Rob Mac, TJ, Roger and more will be back and will push the rest of the field even further forward. Give it 5 more years and you will see Icelandic hill climbing in rocks after a 120mph whoop section that rivals San Philipe. And the heros of both sports on the podium along with some new guys we dont even know yet. I cant FN wait!
     
  6. Valerie D

    Valerie D Member

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2008
    Location:
    Evergreen, CO
    I agree, none of the desert racers have taken the rocks seriously yet. It was good to have Robby and TJ there to give it a try, and Adam Householder, Rick D. Johnson, and Mikey Childress were in Hammertown; Rick raced it two years ago with Mike Palmer. Desert go fast stuff is a whole hell of a lot different in a solid axle vehicle, except those of you that race Jeepspeed already know. But damn, the rocks on this years course, especially on Spoonsers, were ginormous! And what boulders were uncovered on the climb up Fisher Mountain from lap 1 to lap 2 were huge compared to the goat trail it was on lap 1. Shannon Campbells IFS buggy works well in the rocks and the fast, I watched Jason Scherer in his new IFS buggy on Spooners and Outter Limits and those two trails alone I would not want IFS. He struggled, those that tried to help him get up a 5 ft waterfall ended up breaking a lower link off their buggy in the process. Wrecking ball waterfall was detrimental to several buggies, we pulled cable and it may have been an extra 5 minutes, but we finished the race where three quarters of the field did not (finished 24th). And the cluster**[​IMG] ¡Ay, caramba!****[​IMG] ¡Ay, caramba!****[​IMG] ¡Ay, caramba!****[​IMG] ¡Ay, caramba!**asaurus on the Chocolate Thunder gatekeeper was unnecessary. It is an easy line if you take the time to see where your tires go instead of trying to throttle over it and end up turtled or upside down. Rocks are big, you have to learn how to read them and know where your tires are for placement and have a good understanding of what the vehicle will do when it flexes out and where its flopping point is. I love the rocks! As we were going up Wrecking Ball on lap one my driver Alex Hardaway had to tell me to calm down, apparently I was a bit to giddy. OH, and as we're going down Spooners I had to giggle thinking about Pistols ramp idea with a truck. Sorry buddy, but I'm pretty sure you would be used as traction on that trail and we would send out the recovery crew later.
     
  7. balduccibrosracing

    balduccibrosracing New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 19, 2009
    Location:
    Central Pennsylvania
    I think someone like TJ or RG will be a serious contender soon. Lots of things you need to do rock crawling are not necessarily comfortable or natural to do. As much difference as there is between competition rock crawling and KOH style racing, competition experience is huge. Fluidly shifting to front wheel only for a tight front dig or drop off is not something that many desert racers will instinctively do. Prep and tuning are huge weaknesses for many rock crawling teams on the other hand. I'm excited to see how we can do against a race program like RGs. His involvement in the sport will change the game whether he is able to pick things up quick or not. I loved watching RG at Dakar and the way that he works even harder when the going gets tough. I expect the same intensity from his U4 program.
     
  8. Ramsey_ElWardani

    Ramsey_ElWardani Ironman

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2001
    Location:
    Rancho Nuevo (Cabo), B.C.S., San Diego
    Rock racers are just better drivers than desert racers. If you put a rock racer in a Trophy Truck and gave them a 50 miles of test time, they would Overall the Baja 1000 their first time.
     
  9. Racerinside

    Racerinside Member

    Joined:
    Aug 20, 2007
    Location:
    Lemon Grove, CA
    Only in a 4wd, though
     
  10. DoitforBMoore

    DoitforBMoore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2009
    Location:
    LasVegas NV


    [video=youtube;mXHRwsW905M]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mXHRwsW905M&feature=youtu.be[/video]


    Really..... I mean come on...
     
    (+2) 2 people like this.
  11. SuperRanger

    SuperRanger Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2005
    Location:
    Colorado Springs, CO
    Talented driver's will always rise to the top but there are a couple truths to this race.

    1) The guys that runs out there all year are going to be competitive
    2) Rock crawling / racing breeds patience which is needed for racing through boulders.
    3) The skill set for racing on rocks is a lot more specialized than the skill set for hauling ass on dirt / desert / pavement. Kind of like trials bikes vs. off-road bikes.
     
  12. sirhk100

    sirhk100 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2001
    Location:
    las vegas, Nv

    What's your point? Are you going to judge an entire group of drivers from a single wreck? Cause if that's the case you might as well post the pictures of the trucks on their side from parker 2 weeks ago too.
     
  13. DoitforBMoore

    DoitforBMoore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2009
    Location:
    LasVegas NV
    Did you not see where I quoted his post........................................................................................... Cause if thats the case go back and look and you would understand what I did there. Stop trying to make a big deal out of a joke that you obviously did NOT get.
     
  14. Ramsey_ElWardani

    Ramsey_ElWardani Ironman

    Joined:
    Apr 1, 2001
    Location:
    Rancho Nuevo (Cabo), B.C.S., San Diego
    You thought I was serious, really?
     
  15. DoitforBMoore

    DoitforBMoore Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 16, 2009
    Location:
    LasVegas NV
    NO!!!!!!!!! lol I was adding to your comment.
     
  16. sirhk100

    sirhk100 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2001
    Location:
    las vegas, Nv
    Oh that's right... I forgot that a wreck that sent both drivers to the hospital one with both ankles broken and another with possible head injury is funny. That's right... HAHAHAHA Yeah, I get it now... :/


    [​IMG]
     
  17. Poisonous

    Poisonous Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2010
    Location:
    Redlands, CA
    I'd say this is honestly one of the most important aspects needed for KOH or any rockcrawling/racing. After watching the cluster at Chocolate Thunder, Mikey said to me that he didn't get why people were just sitting there waiting. The prime line was where the cluster was at, whereas the bypass caused damage to several vehicles. The key in this race is patience and finesse. Many of the throttle happy drivers take themselves out of the race by causing damage to the car leaving some of the top finishers to be the "rock donkeys" that came out of nowhere from the back of the pack.

    I had my doubts about RG, but seeing how well he handled the rocks in qualifying blew me away. A talented driver is a talented driver, no matter what type of race you put him in. There's some desert racers that will eventually smoke the field at KOH with the right equipment, and there's some rockcrawlers that would probably give some desert guys a run for their money in Baja. No need for the "Dust Junkie" vs "Rock Donkey" hate.

    In regards to Matt Messer: he is a talented driver and would've been a top contender in the race. Accidents happen. Rock faces jump out on passes at the Hammers. I think the insinuation that he isn't a good driver is completely disrespectful. With that being said, Matt & Nick are in my prayers for speedy recoveries.
     
  18. sirhk100

    sirhk100 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2001
    Location:
    las vegas, Nv
    Oh and welcome to the forum Matt! I noticed he just signed up this morning!


    LOL, but it made for awesome spectating!!!!


    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Feb 13, 2012
  19. JoeyD23

    JoeyD23 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2007
    Location:
    North County Dago - CA
    Shannon Campbell broke it down to us in a pre race interview for Monster Energy. Most the desert racers who come over are probably better drivers, more experienced, etc etc. BUT, what the desert racers lack when coming over to test themselves at KOH's is good equipment, or as Shannon stated as "good junk". He fears that guys like RG come over but then get into a vehicle that is a pile compared to what he and some others are driving and then DNF and get turned off by the experience.

    So according to Shannon it comes down to equipment and most of the desert racers who have attempted hammers have done so in less that stellar equipment.
     
  20. Poisonous

    Poisonous Member

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2010
    Location:
    Redlands, CA
    Precisely! If you take a look at the crossovers that have attempted, every single one of the DNF's was due to mechanical failure. Give it time; it won't be long before a desert racer takes the crown.
     

Share This Page