MIG "trigger" welding

Discussion in 'Shop - Fabrication' started by Iggle, Apr 29, 2012.

  1. Iggle

    Iggle Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2007
    Location:
    Lake forest
    I know this type of MIG weld looks good, but is it really a "sound" weld? Does the constant starting and stopping of the weld cause problems? Is the weld hot enough? It seems like this is the preferred method of most of the people in the off road industry but mostly because of the way the weld looks when it's complete. Do any big shops test these welds? Do they pass inspection?

    Curious to see what actual certified welders out there have to say. Any certified welding inspectors on this forum?

    Thanks for your thoughts.
    Iggy
  2. atomicjoe23

    atomicjoe23 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Feb 2, 2008
    Location:
    Silverdale, WA
    What a hornet's nest! This topic always brings up quite the debate. . .

    Depends on the welder and how good they are.

  3. gawdodirt

    gawdodirt Member

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    May 22, 2003
    Location:
    Gilbert, AZ
    There was a thread about this where a shop did X-ray and destructive tested "trigger " welds and found them to be as safe as other MIG welds. Again, like it was stated, depending on the person doing the welding. Buy a high end pulse MIG and learn to use it. Then you'll have to tools to produce good welds. Oh and lots of seat time.

    GD
  4. kdm73091

    kdm73091 Member

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    Aug 27, 2008
    Location:
    west hills
    ususaly when people trigger weld its cause the material is to thin and you arent able to put alot of heat into the material such as sheet metal work.... to a trained eye you are able to tell whats trigger welded and whats a full bead. in my opinion its crappy fab work to trigger weld anything thats structual, you arent able to get enough heat and penetration into the material to properly fuse the metal together. i think people should just actualy learn how to weld....
  5. gawdodirt

    gawdodirt Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2003
    Location:
    Gilbert, AZ
    Wow. Pretty harsh. There's a place for trigger welding. The thread I read stated that in destructive testing or X-ray, it is as good as any full bead. If it's that critical, just TIG the whole thing.

    GD
  6. StokedMotorSport

    StokedMotorSport Member

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    Jul 22, 2009
    Location:
    Ramona CA
    two words COLD LAP.
  7. BajaFand

    BajaFand Well-Known Member

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    Oct 17, 2005
    Location:
    San Dimas, CA
    There is no place for trigger welding in ANYTHING structural. Dzus tabs and bedsides are one thing but I find it dangerous to think that there are so many people using this technique to weld rollcages. There shouldn't be any reason to weld in that fashion.

    I'm not saying it's impossible for a trigger weld to be structurally sound and I'm sure there are some that are. I'll admit that I've done it on few things that aren't structural. I'm just saying it's a bad habit and is not a correct form of welding. I'd rather have an ugly continuous bead then a pretty trigger weld holding the cage above my head together. Please post a link to the thread.
  8. DBMETALWORX

    DBMETALWORX Well-Known Member

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    Jul 11, 2007
    Location:
    BUCKEYE AZ
    Amen!!
  9. Jerry Zaiden

    Jerry Zaiden Well-Known Member

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    Mar 22, 2001
    Location:
    Huntington Beach, CA
    Trigger welds = hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold hot-cold etc... Total crap for critical parts

    Same goes for peddle pumpers when tig welding.

    Both techniques are for people who don't have skill and have to "draw" the weld bead not let the weld bead form from proper technique.
  10. Iggle

    Iggle Member

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2007
    Location:
    Lake forest
    So if pumping the pedal when TIG welding is also incorrect, what is the correct form? Just using a pulsing TIG machine where the pulse is built into the machine? Isn't that accomplishing the same thing?
  11. gawdodirt

    gawdodirt Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2003
    Location:
    Gilbert, AZ

    This is exactly right . On higher end welders, you have the option of having the machine do the work. And it is preferred method for critical welds. Lincoln and Miller both highly tout the method of pulsing the current to MINIMIZE HEAT INPUT. Too much heat IS as bad as too little. Do some research.

    GD
  12. Samco Fab

    Samco Fab Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 5, 2005
    Location:
    Reno NV
    Adding a bit of throttle as you dip the filler seems logical to me, the filler cools the weld puddle so that it needs more heat. I suppose fully on and off the pedal would be bad, but modulating the heat imput as you add filler has to be a good idea. There is a lot of ways to skin a cat, and a lot of good welding techniques.

    If you look at a Robby Gordon truck (double pass weave) , a Mike Smith or SPD truck (traditional constant pedal dip...dip...dip...) , or a Geiser/ Jimco (pedal modulation while dipping) they are all welded with different styles and they are all strong and beautiful.

    Proper heat imput overall, and proper amount of filler is more important that the style of tig in my book.
  13. mikeyfrombc

    mikeyfrombc Member

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    Whonnock B.C. Canada
  14. kdm73091

    kdm73091 Member

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    Aug 27, 2008
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    west hills
    no whats funny is how this thread turned into a tig pulsing thread... look at the title, it clearly says mig.... between tig and mig pulsing are two completely different welds....
  15. gawdodirt

    gawdodirt Member

    Joined:
    May 22, 2003
    Location:
    Gilbert, AZ
    Not really. When you look at the wave form of the current, they are the similar. When I trigger
    Weld, I raise the voltage to compensate for the cooling period. Just like a TIG pulse does. The penetration is as good if
    Not better. And it looks much better.
  16. fathead

    fathead Active Member

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    Jun 30, 2003
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    Torrance Ca.
  17. Jerry Zaiden

    Jerry Zaiden Well-Known Member

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    Mar 22, 2001
    Location:
    Huntington Beach, CA
    Using the pulse setting correctly is for certain metals, thickness, look etc. but on .120 or thicker material in a structural application trigger and pulse is just plain not correct. Like i said it is done by people who cant control the heat, dont have the proper technique, and plain just don't weld correctly. Argue it all you want. Go take welding classes then come back here and lets see what you have to say.

    Good skill no pulse.

    ImageUploadedByTapatalk1336534012.545626.jpg
  18. atomicjoe23

    atomicjoe23 Well-Known Member

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    Feb 2, 2008
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    Silverdale, WA
    AWESOME pic!!!
  19. garagebuilder

    garagebuilder Member

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    Jan 21, 2005
    Location:
    Brea, CA
    Welding is very simple concept. It's just a very concentrated casting. Get the parent materials hot enough that they will "wet" and accept molten filler, the more constant you keep the variables (heat, filler, speed) the higher quality the weld.

    Pulsing of any type, mig or tig, isn't the best choice, but it works if you scale the heat up so that the material is heat soaked properly. I try to pump the pedal as little as possible, it takes longer and it usually doesn't lay as flat/smooth as constant pedal, there are situations where is is necessary though.
  20. richard cretsinger

    richard cretsinger Active Member

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2005
    Location:
    trailorsville, ut.
    I feel that there should be no pulsing for mig welding, either you have skill at doing it correctly or you dont. There are to many people who rely on there machine to figure it out for them "millermatic skills" but a skilled welder can figure out if its to hot or to cold. Or open the lid, most welders have a pretty close calculation of where you should be at for what your welding. Pulse mig is for those that cant make it look good any other way, I agree, to much cold hot, cold hot is bad, especially on chromo is a bad thing. i would think it would make it brittle. Im just a garage slut that doesnt know how to measure things, so take that for what its worth. Those lower arms look good jerry.

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