930 CV's/ Stub axles

Ryno

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930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

When can I get some 930 CV's? I need to have some stub axles made, and I need to CV's to make them work. I'm starting my long travel idea, and actually got a friend to met me try it on his truck first. =) I'll let everyone know how it goes...we wanna go coilover, but I might have to settle for a coilover like the ones for the tacoma (this is for a 88-98 Chevy 4wd). I'm stuck at the t-case....The stocker won't hold up over 40 mph. =(

Ryno

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Bob_Sheaves

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Ryan,

You might check out the following URL:

http://www.newventuregear.com/tcases.html - home of New Venture Gear. Specifically, I'd look at the NV242HD or NV242HD/AMG as used in the HMMWV. This will give you the advantage of both AWD and locked part time 4WD capability.

Another option would be the NV124/125 for Full time AWD only (high speed -single gearing - no low range).

All of these can be mounted directly to your GM trans.

Best as always,

Bob Sheaves

<P ID="edit"><FONT SIZE=-1>Edited by Bob_Sheaves on 02/21/02 07:52 PM (server time).</FONT></P>
 

Ryno

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Bob-

You're the man! thanks for the info!! Not looking forward to seeing the pricetag though. =(

Ryno

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rdc

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Ryno,

What Transfer Case are you currently running in your truck and what happens at 40 mph? Were you in high or low range? Also, what tire size, final drive ratio and transmission is in your vehicle. Before you go out and buy a new T-Case it would be best to figure out what caused the failure then explore some of the options.

Dennis Cook
Xfactor Engineering
 

Ryno

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Dennis-

I have an NP 241, stock for the 4X4 88-98 fullsize chevy trucks. The final drive of the transmission is 1-1. The is in 3rd gear, since I don't used OD while in 4x. I have a 3.73 rear end, and at about 40, it starts to whine a little more than I'd like. The t-case is in 4hi, and I just changed the fluid and filled it about 2 months ago. I am in the process of trying to build a long travel for the truck, and have pretty much everything figured out except the CV's. I know I can have a cog made for a higher speed in the t-case, just a matter of drawing it up on CAD, and taking it to a machine shop. I'm not looking to build a desert racer, just a couple of chevy guys trying to get more travel out of our trucks. =)

Ryno

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FABRICATOR

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Ryno,
What is it you are trying to do? Someone sells a kit that uses at least a 930 on the inside end of the axle to replace the 3 ball joint. Why would you need stub axles made? You can't use a 930 on the wheel end of the axle. What's up?

<font color=orange>The best ideas are the ones that look obvious to the casual observer.</font color=orange>
 

Bob_Sheaves

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Hi Fabricator!

By using a "930" (properly called a Rzeppa joint) on both the inner and outer locations, along with a cut down slip shaft amd yoke (Dana 1330/1340 will do in this application, if you cut off the ears of the yoke and machine a flange to replace it) you can obtain up to a 45 degree total travel travel with the halfshaft (by paying attention to the install and assembly phasing and the stops to prevent pulling the joints apart).

BTW-check your email later today for a response to the other email you sent.

Best as always,

Bob Sheaves
 

Bob_Sheaves

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Addendum to the t/c answer....

Check out the info from NVG, but search the Gov't surplus auctions for the NV242HD/AMG case. I have seen them go for as low as $150.00 in pieces (unassembled). That's where I obtained mine for my Blazer- I paid $390.00 for a surplus rebuilt unit, including the AMG shifter assembly. The new cost is around $3000.00 as I remember.

Best as always,

Bob Sheaves
 

Ryno

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Fabricator-

I am trying to get the maximum travel from a chevy fullsize IFS truck. I need a longer stub axle off of the front diff, so I can run longer A-arms. I am also trying to get a coil spring strong enough to handle a fullsize truck, but only go 1/2 way, to still afford room for the front axleshaft. Nobody has done this yet, and I'm bound and determined to make it work. I'm not looking for 15+ inches of travel, just about 10-12.


Bob-

I haven't a clue where to find a surplus auction. At the same time, $400 for a t-case sounds really nice, and I'm sure the factory linkage would need some massaging, but could work. I saw they also make a 241HD. Is the 4HI in the 242 a higher gear? I think the 4HI for the 241 is 1-1. I know the 241's aren't known for strength, but at the same time, the truck still needs to be streetable, and relatively easy to shift, since the wife will sometimes be @ the helm (God help me). Thanks as always

Ryan

Build it like a Rhino, and Leave it be.
 

Bob_Sheaves

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Hi Ryan,

Check out:

http://www.drms.dla.mil/newsales/

....for the DRMS property auctions and catalog. There is a series of FAQ's, catalog listing, search by NSN (National Stock Number) or description, etc. Cool site for military surplus parts, direct from the gov't.

The NV241HD will interchange as an assembly, but the components are different (you just can't swap chains and sprockets, for example). The 242 from the Hummer/HMMWV is a cheaper and stronger alternative (if you can get one surplus), as it is a full time unit (the HMMWV shift mechanism does not even have a part time position for example) that is made for that weight vehicle (10K GVW) and is darn near bulletproof for your application. The full time feature will also add tractive stability for street use (great for the less experienced driver-as long as they don't get throttle happy). One downside is a fuel milage penalty-about 1.0 to 1.5mpg less with ful ltime AWD.

The high range is still 1:1 on the 242 case so a speedo correction (other than for your selection of tires) is not needed. Your OE shifter can be used if you want-just mill out a new shift plate as needed (not a big deal). You should be able to call NVG Aftermarket (the phone number is on their website) and get a drawing of the pattern with the dimentions needed.

One suggestion on the 8.25 AAM front axle-use a 1" thick spacer with the double bolt pattern to match up the axle flange to the joints- you will appreciate the little bit of extra length in the half shaft you will get this way, and you won't spend as much hobbing out the shaft spline. Just a thought.....

Another item that comes to mind that is a weak link in the axle is the thermal shift for the locking of the axle disconnect. I'd definately go to the Warn cable mechanism -$60-70.00 or so- to keep from getting stranded when it fails (and it will). If you go to the NV242 case-the axle shaft disconnect will need to be engaged all the time-the stock parts WILL fail.

Best as always,

Bob Sheaves
 

FABRICATOR

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Hi Bob,
A "930" is a Lobro style (called a "cross-groove" joint) not a true Rzeppa joint. These are the popular German made stand-in for a real CV joint. They only go about 21 degrees or so and even then they get hot. The age old problem of using Rzeppa joints for inner and outer locations is that you have to provide some other means for axle plunge. They don't have enough room inside to let spline slip take care of that problem. That's why the factories came out with the 3 balled joint (called "tripot", "tripode" or "tripod" by various manufacturers) a long time ago and nearly everyone has used it ever since. Unfortunately, it only stays happy up to about 20 degrees at best. There is a very reliable and proven way to provide the needed plunge for a 2 Rzeppa joint shaft, but that's another story. A Rzeppa outer and a "Lobro" style inner is a compatable setup as the inner will "take the plunge."

Ryno,
There is still something missing here. Unless you are changing the inner pivot point of the lower control arm, you should not be moving the location of the CV joint. But you will need flanged stub shafts from the front differential that can bolt to the "930's". I have seen the setup like what you are describing on a raised, full size Chevy. The inner joints looked bigger than 930's. It had the stock outer joints and I think an after market axle shaft. The whole thing had to be a kit from someone but I don't know who. This truck was a huge Disco wagon, really raised up a lot, had huge tires, and looked to have more than stock travel. As far as springs, you will probably have to use some type of OEM units. Dodge uses some big coil springs. A good dealer parts person can give you actual spring rates on some units. This information is often on the micro-fiche parts page for various applications. I assume a 205 T/C won't fit your application???

<font color=orange>The best ideas are the ones that look obvious to the casual observer.</font color=orange>
 

Bob_Sheaves

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Hi Fabricator-

I stand corrected-20 laps in a 9 car as punishment......LOL sorry, could not resist. I was under the impression that the 930 was a Rzeppa.

Using the inner and outer Rzeppa (a GKN for example-see below URL) with a slip shaft has been used on many vehicles up to the 45 degree limit-but they get warm (a "bit") at that running angle at or near critical speed-so they need a synthetic lube to prevent failure. The slip shaft end has external splines to match the Rzeppa internal splines, and the slip yoke (with the cut off ears) would be flanged to the outer joint with a floating spud shaft for driving the wheel, splined to the inner splines on the outer Rzeppa. A pair of circlips on either side of the Rzeppa can provide the retention here, as long as the spindle is designed to be a "full floating" type, like an old Dana 44 or 60 front with the large bolt pattern and seperate spindle. The Tripod Saginaw's (or AAM's now) or other type of 3 points tend to be a bit weak, in my experience, for this kind of travel.

http://www.gkndriveline.co.uk/products/index_mjd.asp

Best as always,

Bob Sheaves
 

Ryno

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Fabricator-

I am not planning to move the location of the CV joint, I am simply wanting a longer shaft from the joint, to the hub. I am also wanting to have a beefier CV in there so I can get more travel. The upper arms are cake, it's the lower arm I can't decide what to do. Torsion bars would be easy, but coilovers would give me a way softer ride, and less hassle. I would like to extend the arms 2" per side, thus the need for the longer stub from the CV to the hub. thanks for the info.

Ryno

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rdc

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

Man, you guys must really like to hear yourselves talk because you are making this out to be way more complicated than it really is. All you have to do is make an adapter plate for the inner CV to bolt a 930 CV to the GM IFS diff, you can then use the stock outer six-ball fixed joint and have custom axles made, there are a few places that can do this, Cone, SAW or Summers Bros. Many people have done it this way, most of the CORE pro-4 trucks and Donahoe did some Ford F-150's a couple of years back.
 

Ryno

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Re: 930 CV\'s/ Stub axles

That basically the plan. The CV from the diff will stay in the same spot, but will be a 930. The stub axle from the 930 to the hub joint will need to be lengthened, the same amount as the arms, depending on geometry. I understand all that, and I talked to Summer Bros today....they said to get my arms done, and then talk to them when I needed the axles. I also need to figure out if I can run a coilover to get rid of the t-bars, or whether I am better off keeping the buggers. The issue is clearance for the front drive axle.

Ryno



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