Are RZRs tainting Ocotillo

[Phatman_9]

FIRST OFF THIS IS NOT MEANT TO OFFEND UTV DRIVERS/OWNERS!!! ITS JUST MY OPINION AND WHAT I HAVE NOTICED!

The recent trip to ocotillo wells has left me pretty upset. There seems to be small bumps/ruts throughout every main dirt road/wash/dune/hillside throughout ocotillo wells/plaster city areas. Are these ruts from the 4wd and tires on the RZR or what? Because they rattle my insides going fast on my dirtbike and force me to go on the outside to the deep whoops for miles on end.

I just recently noticed these bumps are getting worse and worse after appearing during the enormous boom of RZRs/Can-Ams starting around 2016-present. More and more people are turning to these side by sides and are making the desert not only more dangerous to motorcycle/atv enthusiasts, but are making the roads terrible.

Lastly, most of these people are new to the desert, have little courtesy to others and are wreck less when driving in tight places. Just last weekend we nearly experienced a head on collision with a rzr in the slots because the lead rzr didn’t put up any signals to let us know he had a group.

Comment if you have an answer for the bumps or if you have experienced this I figured it can’t just be me.

 

[NIKAL]

I think it’s a combination of several things. The UTV has made the desert more accessible for the mainstream public. Just like when 3 wheelers and quads came out, the general public could go to a dealership and purchase a quad and ride in the desert.

Back when it was just dirt bikes and buggy's with VW engines you had to have both talent to ride a bike and mechanical skills to build or maintain a buggy. You went to places like Fiber Tech or ORW to buy your buggy parts. Plus bikes had 25 hp and buggys had 80 hp. Oh and everything was cash!

I remember people saying the same thing when 3 wheelers and quads came out. They would zig zag all over the place with out the etiquette we were used to. And people could get a loan to buy one!

What is different now is more people find recreational off roading more fun. Technology has advanced allowing vehicles to be built with 100’s of HP, feet not inches of wheel travel, massive tires up to 40 inches, and again you don’t have to have skill or mechanical ability to own or use one. Just a credit score to finance one.

Plus the RV life has grown 100 fold. My wife would not camp in a tent, or in a small slide in truck camper. We now have mini homes on wheels. TV, Microwaves, showers, slide outs. Toyhaulers Etc.. This takes some of the dirty roughing it out, which kept people away too.

So while today’s buggy, quad & 3 wheeler are now called UTV’s it’s very easy to say it’s the UTV that’s causing all the chatter bumps, increased popularity and lack of etiquette.
BTW I’ve had bike guys wave at me when I put up 2 fingers. They think I’m saying Peace! And they are waving back. Not telling me their is 5 bikes behind them! So bike guys can be just as dumb.

 

[partybarge_pilot]

Razor chatter is horrible. Any idiot with a credit card can buy a very capable machine. Then they think they are RG and drive way over there heads. New years was my first time out there on a bike in 6 years. The difference is staggering. Almost all the single track in shell reef is now golf cart wide and whooped out. I spent most of my time in the street legal areas to get away from them.

 

[powerbox_builder]

We call it "Razor Burn" Ocotollo to Plaster City is smoked. The other phenomena we've noticed is they love to stop in the middle of the road. Even prerunning Baja I've come up on so many groups of side by sides just stopped in the middle of the road. I've decided the only solution must be a luxury Trophy Truck prerunner. Do they feel razor burn? My buddy just built one for only 400K. I think I need to start saving.

 

[Rslhc]

There was a thread in the main Desert Racing thread about this a while back. I live in havasu, and the awesome roads and trails I grew up riding have been so destroyed by this. Exactly what you described on every moderately soft trail or road. The worst is that on a bike, there’s literally nothing you can do to make it benter. Fast, slow, nothing makes it better.

NIKAL covered it well. It’s partly the design of the machines. It’s largely the increased desert traffic. It’s partly driving habits and technique.

At this point, the only help is dragging or grading the real bad trails. Our local 4 wheel club drags several of our common washes to keep us all sane.

Around here, it has pushed us to working to stay on the single track more. No razor burn / rzr chop there. Haha

 

[BajaboundMoto]

RAZOR BURN !
Learned that term a while back from PowerBox Builder ;-)
And yes O'Wells has become horrible and unrideable over the past 5 years.

 

[BGRANT]

Same goes for the main stream areas up here in Utah, I can't imagine how bad the SoCal deserts are getting. There is still plenty of single track up here and that is mostly what we ride. I do have a a razor as well and its amazing how capable it is out of the box with a few mods compared to my B&R pre-runner I had 10 years ago. As a dirt bike rider at heart, when I am in the razor I always try and stay on established 2-track and am very conscientious about not jacking up any single track and try and keep a smooth right foot so everything doesn't get whooped out.
The trail etiquette drives me crazy, while there are a few moto guys that don't use or know hand singles, it is primarily the 4 wheel people that are clueless. I try to educate people when I have the chance and I think staging areas should have a sign with basic hand signals.....most can't or won't read it though.
We are lucky up here to have cattle bridges that only a dirt bike can get over so it keeps the single track single.
I am getting old and beat up so the cage is nice when my body won't allow me to throw a leg over the seat, plus I can get the wife and non moto friends out in the dirt.

 

[Tee Roy]

FIRST OFF THIS IS NOT MEANT TO OFFEND UTV DRIVERS/OWNERS!!! ITS JUST MY OPINION AND WHAT I HAVE NOTICED!

The recent trip to ocotillo wells has left me pretty upset. There seems to be small bumps/ruts throughout every main dirt road/wash/dune/hillside throughout ocotillo wells/plaster city areas. Are these ruts from the 4wd and tires on the RZR or what? Because they rattle my insides going fast on my dirtbike and force me to go on the outside to the deep whoops for miles on end.

I just recently noticed these bumps are getting worse and worse after appearing during the enormous boom of RZRs/Can-Ams starting around 2016-present. More and more people are turning to these side by sides and are making the desert not only more dangerous to motorcycle/atv enthusiasts, but are making the roads terrible.

Lastly, most of these people are new to the desert, have little courtesy to others and are wreck less when driving in tight places. Just last weekend we nearly experienced a head on collision with a rzr in the slots because the lead rzr didn’t put up any signals to let us know he had a group.

Comment if you have an answer for the bumps or if you have experienced this I figured it can’t just be me.

The SXS guys need to learn hand signals and common courtesy.. 99% Of the SXS out in Ocotillo Wells DO NOT use hand signals.. the common peace sign is always thrown up or a simple wave.. makes me laugh... it is very dangerous for us bike guys when they are not using hand signals.. this has driven me away from Ocotillo Wells and moved on to the BLM and street legal areas..
It would be awesome if ironwoods or blu inn can put on a safety / learning course / class for these beginners.

 

[partybarge_pilot]

The SXS guys need to learn hand signals and common courtesy.. 99% Of the SXS out in Ocotillo Wells DO NOT use hand signals.. the common peace sign is always thrown up or a simple wave.. makes me laugh... it is very dangerous for us bike guys when they are not using hand signals.. this has driven me away from Ocotillo Wells and moved on to the BLM and street legal areas..
It would be awesome if ironwoods or blu inn can put on a safety / learning course / class for these beginners.

This X1000! I had one guy that knew what he was doing in the 2 weeks I was out there. Most just wave at you, the rest stare at you like "why is he holding up 3 fingers at me?"

 

[cjohnson]

Another bash the SXS thread Remember with age comes cage I hated three wheelers, quads, SXS, jeeps. I hated them all. Now I have a SXS, I'm so ashamed

 

[NIKAL]

This X1000! I had one guy that knew what he was doing in the 2 weeks I was out there. Most just wave at you, the rest stare at you like "why is he holding up 3 fingers at me?"

I think it’s more of an age or generational thing. I grew up as a little kid going to the desert with family & grandparents. As a kid we learned hand signals from our parents. In car radios or intercoms did not exist. Hand signals is how you communicated with everyone. Plus people were just more courteous vs the DGAF attitude so many have now a days.

I’m still not convinced of “Razer Burn” as much as Population Burn. I think its a pure numbers thing. Way more people have access to the desert today then ever before. And maybe more are using UTV’s vs anything else, so it’s easy to blame the vehicle and not the person?

Also think about back when the dunes were full of swing axle, mid engine VW buggys. Then the long travel car with bigger engines came out and all the swingers were pissed off that the high HP big travel cars were destroying & whooping out the dunes.

Kinda like all the limited class blame the Country Clubbers with 1000hp and 40 inch tires ruining Baja and all the good race courses?

 

[cjohnson]

I think it’s more of an age or generational thing.

I agree. I feel it's the "get off my lawn" mentality. I understand because I've been on bikes since the mid 70's but the SXS folks have just as much right to be out there as anybody.

 

[Fourstroker]

I think it’s more of an age or generational thing. I grew up as a little kid going to the desert with family & grandparents. As a kid we learned hand signals from our parents. In car radios or intercoms did not exist. Hand signals is how you communicated with everyone. Plus people were just more courteous vs the DGAF attitude so many have now a days.

I agree. I am always the leader of our group and on a bike. I learned the signals like you when I was young. Still find myself putting up my left arm (Stop) when I come across something major. Passed it on to my kids and wife as well

 

[KCCI8DR]

I'm an old bike guy but I also have a sxs. That chop is horrible no matter what vehicle. And it's everywhere you go. We ride in the Ocotillo (not wells) area. A buddy had a head on crash with with a Razor driven by kids with no helmets. Busted up his legs bad.
There should be some kind of training requirement for people to drive those things. Way too many folks out there with no experience. All packed into a small area the Government allows us to use.. its almost no fun anymore.

 

[cjohnson]

There should be some kind of training requirement for people to drive those things.

California Vehicle Code §38503 states no person under age 18 shall operate an ATV on public lands unless satisfying one of the following conditions:

• They are taking a prescribed safety training course under the direct supervision of a certified all-terrain vehicle safety instructor.
  
  
• They are in possession of an appropriate ATV safety certificate issued by this state or issued under the authority of another state.
  
  
• They are under the direct supervision of a parent or guardian, or an adult authorized by the parent or guardian, who is in possession of an appropriate ATV safety certificate issued by this state or issued under the authority of another state.
  
  
• In addition, riders under the age of 14 must either possess an ATV safety certificate or the adult supervising the rider must possess an ATV safety certificate. NOTE: No matter who possesses the ATV safety certificate, all riders age 14 and under must be supervised by an adult.
  
  
• Riders age 14-17 may ride without adult supervision, but must possess an ATV safety certificate.

Have you had your training?

 

[NIKAL]

Went to Superstition this weekend. I think due to Covid we are seeing allot more people out there, in UTV’s! But there was also a 4 wheeler club and D38 race with bikes and UTV’s out there. So for me it was a dusty mad house!

But what I really noticed is yes it’s more tore up, which is clearly due to volume of traffic, Wheeler Rd is proof of that. The road was horrible! But we’ve had no rain in months so everything was soft and choppy. But my biggest complaint was the trash left behind on the flats and lake bed. Total disrespect! One spot had a complete EZUP with a 3ft tall pile of trash next to it. Then over on the flats where the porta-potty’s were brought in for the D38 race you could see where race camps had left cans, bottles and general trash around there camps.

I can live with the “Razor Burn” as Mother Nature’s rain, wind and summer time temps will fix that. But the trash is not just going to go away!

 

[DG_BTI]

so funny to see this thread. I mentioned it in the other thread a couple months ago and got lit up as a dumbass. Its a fact the utv's have effed up most trails in my riding grounds.

 

[cjohnson]

so funny to see this thread. I mentioned it in the other thread a couple months ago and got lit up as a dumbass. Its a fact the utv's have effed up most trails in my riding grounds.

The response was correct on the other thread for the specific comments you made. I don't think you would have gotten "lit up" if you would have limited your comments to saying UTVs are messing up the trails.

 

[DG_BTI]

The response was correct on the other thread for the specific comments you made. I don't think you would have gotten "lit up" if you would have limited your comments to saying UTVs are messing up the trails.

I am not limiting my comments at all. The utv's cause the excessive washboard, fact. They ruined pretty much all the trails I have ridden on my bike for the last 30 years, fact. The bumps in question are from utvs, period. Not limiting a thing.

 

[cjohnson]

You may think it's a fact but that does not make it one. I have ridden my bike for 30 years too and the chop has always been bad I just don't whine about it.