Ashleys trophy truck

FABRICATOR

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Rhyno
Good question, but this trans was installed into a carbureted 454 that runs fine. EFI is great but a bit expensive for an older vehicle.
The installation was done way back in about 94. At that time, the only computers available were the GM Diesel or one from "E-Place" of Canada. Art Carr was selling these things with no guarantee and NO HELP. I had to take the valve body to Trans-Go and have them figure out some problems. Those guys probably know more about valve bodies than anyone else, but they are sometimes back logged. The computer I have is a bit crude but it has been reliable and gets the job done. Relying solely on input from a MAP sensor and one internal speed sensor is not quite enough. Accel and some others have some pretty sophisticated units that are programmable with a PC. You can download programming right from their web site, and also modify the parameters. You should not need any fancy hard parts other than the better sprag unit just like te 400's. The Trans-Go kit has several items that increase reliability. Unlike the 400, the pump in a 4L80 is variable in displacement and pressure (displacement, by way of a movable crescent between the gears). If things aren't right the big servo cavity can blow out right through the main case. These things can shift way harder than any 400 (like a major nerf) and break other things. They do not share any major parts with the 4L60E. (This is an electronic 700R4). When properly set up, they are a bit stronger than a turbo 400 and quite bullet proof.

<font color=orange>The best ideas are the ones that look obvious to the casual observer.</font color=orange>
 

Dave_G

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Re: Is the Herbst trans a modified off-the-shelf unit

No. It's all custom designed by Traction Products. We patricipated in the manufacturing of some of the components and cases and have been actively involved in trouble shooting the torque shaft problem.

Dave

"I know it all, but I can't remember most of it..."
 

drtdevil93

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back to the original post: you are all wrong. i happen to know there is no physical shifter at all. ashley uses his jedi mind control capabilities to choose the proper gear. now you know.

erik
 

drtdevil93

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my other theory is that his cyborg computer brain selects gears and shifts via radio waves.

erik
 

CoiloverKid

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HAHAHAHAHA . . . "Feel, dont think, Ashley-san..."



BRAAAAAAAPPPPP! ! ! !
 

scott

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I heard Herbst is already a million dollars in R&D and testing on the trans, transfer case...... and now the traction controlled transfer case and transmission is some german company's and it could get higher in price on the R&D...... Hey where's Barraza at ????? Tony whats the scoop ?

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Dave_G

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Re: I heard Herbst is already a million dollars in R&D and testing on the trans, transfer case...... and now the traction controlled transfer case and transmission is some german company's and it could get higher in price on the R&D

Scott,
Sounds like the rumor mill is firing up. I manufactured the traction control t-cases and know how much they cost. I also worked on the new 6 speed and know how much is into that project as well. Don't believe everything people tell you. I know for fact that what you have been told is not the case.

Dave

"I know it all, but I can't remember most of it..."
 

Kritter

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Dave, who's doing the design and lab R&D?

Kris
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.csupomona.edu/~kjhernandez>My Web Page</A>
 

Dave_G

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Re: Dave, who's doing the design and lab R&D?

On what??


Dave

"I know it all, but I can't remember most of it..."
 

Kritter

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On the transmission and trnasfercase hardware and software.

Kris
<A target="_blank" HREF=http://www.animalhousedesigns.net>Animal House</A>
 

rdc

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Wasn't the trans made by Wiesman and my understanding of Laughlin was that they were having problems with the electronic sensors on the trans and it would not shift properly.
 

Dave_G

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Re: Wasn't the trans made by Wiesman and my understanding of Laughlin was that they were having problems with the electronic sensors on the trans and it would not shift properly.


Traction Products is Wiesman. The 6 speed was designed by them and the software was provided by them. The project on the 6 speed trans was way behind schedule so we were asked to help manufacture some of the components. The problem at Laughlin was that the trans broke a torque shaft. The computer that controls the t-case crashed and needed to be rebooted so as a result there was no 4 wheel drive working.

Dave

"I know it all, but I can't remember most of it..."
 

Dave_G

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Re: On the transmission and trnasfercase hardware and software

Kris,
T-case was designed by Dennis Cook of X-Factor Engineering in Royal Oak Michigan. The T-cases were manufactured by A.M.D. and the R&D and modifications have been a joint project so to speak between A.M.D. and XFactor. Dennis designs damn nice stuff and it should be noted that the T-case has never suffered a mechanical failure EVER ! As far as who did the software you'd have to ask Dennis. I know he lurks here on the forum.

The 6 speed trans was designed by Traction Products (Wiesman) in Huntington Beach. It is based on transmissions that are used in off shore powerboat racing and F1 cars. They also supplied the software. The trans is a new design so it has had some growing pains that are getting handled.

Dave

"I know it all, but I can't remember most of it..."
 

Tony_Barraza

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Re: Hey where's Barraza at ????? Tony whats the scoop ?

Scott-

C'mon on bro, What I know couldn't fill a gnat's jock strap! LOL!

But seriously, I am confident that the million dollar estimate on t-case/trans production and R&D is way off.
However, when you have people like Wiesman, X-Factor and A.M.D. involved in ANY project, you have committed to it being a quality piece, and as we all know, quality costs! If you haven't seen A.M.D.'s work, the quality speakes for itself!

On the other hand, I would not want to do the math for the investment that has been made in testing alone. Figure man hours, fuel (tractor trailer/chase trucks/race cars), tires, fluids, food/drinks, hotel rooms, etc. Keep in mind, testing of this caliber typically lasts 2 to 4 days, and takes place in the Vegas area.

Although, there is a spare t-case....and a spare trans....Screw it, a million sounds good to me!

Like I said, what I know isn't as valuable as the aluminum shaving's found at the bottom of one of Dave G.'s CNC machines.

BTW - The Terrible Herbst TT experience ZERO TRANS/T-CASE FAILURE at the SCORE S.F. 250! That thing was hookin' and haulin' all day long!

I'm out!

Tony B.
 

rdc

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Dave, Tony thanks for the good words. If I ever need a P.R. team I'm calling you guys!

The T-Case for the Herbst AWD TT was a challenging project that never that would have been nearly impossible to complete without the knowledge and skills of Dave and Wally of AMD. If I remember correctly it was about 10 weeks from the time I delivered the first drawings and disks with the CAD data, to the day the T-Case was bolted in the TT and strapped on the chassis dyno. In fact, I never saw the T-Case before it was bolted in the truck. We didn't even have time to ship the parts to my place in Michigan for final assembly. It went together via me on the phone explaining the proper assembly sequence and Dave building the unit and bolting it together. I jumped on a plane the next day and got to the dyno shop in Huntington Beach ten minutes after the crew started testing. We got about 5 hours of dyno time before the front diff let loose. So far we've had very good luck with the system.

As for the controller....To make a long story short I hacked into an existing controller and loaded in a control logic of my own. It's really a very simple program. I use sensors to read front and rear prop speeds, throttle position and braking. From those inputs the controller decides how much torque is transfered to the front drive and when. As it stands now I have around 3300 programs I can choose from. The funny thing is they are still running The "guess" program I first loaded. Due to other problems with the TT we have never been able to schedule a testing time to tune the AWD system. It looks like after the Terrible's Town race we may finally get the chance. Once that's done I'd like to add some other inputs like steering, vehicle yaw and shock velocity and really try to optimize the system.

Dennis
 

scott

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Tony & Dave --- Right on, I heard that, and I was wondering if anyone can confirm it.. I find it amazing the amounts of money that is spent, just because of the love of the sport... Thanks
 

Dave_G

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Re: amazing the amounts of money that is spent, just because of the love of the sport...

Scott,
The money that gets poured into these projects certainly doesn't go to waste. New design advances and products make their way into the industry as a result of someones dreams. If you think about it, where did bypass shocks come from?? Believe it or not, I know who funded the project and I have pictures of the first bypass shocks ever built. They really are funny looking compared to the ones your probably used to seeing on off road cars today.

Best,
Dave

"I know it all, but I can't remember most of it..."
 

StandOnTheGas

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Call me a gear head. Fascinating stuff. Thanks all of you for sharing.
So Dave G how come your Wa-Zoo one of a kind X-Factor A.M.D., F1, off shore, cyber trans got beat by Jamal's run -of -the -mill production based transmission…? (wink, wink)


THROTTLE DOWN
 

Dave_G

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Re: So Dave G how come your Wa-Zoo one of a kind X-Factor A.M.D., F1, off shore, cyber trans got beat by Jamal's run -of -the -mill production based transmission

Bruce,
Loose nut behind the steering wheel....just kidding. The Herbst TT was running strong ahead of Ashley until they suffered an electrical failure which shut the motor down for a long period of time (no ignition). No drive train failures at the last race. It might be noted though that the Truggy doesn't have any trans problems and it's running just a old style chevy turbo 400. Nothing exotic there except for the Maraging shafts and custom planetary ring gears. As far as Daves trans goes I doubt it's one that comes with a stock Ford truck. I'm sure there's some exotic metals being used for some of the components. The biggest difference between the two transmissions is how hard they get worked. I'll bet money, marbles and chalk that if Jamal had to make that ford transmission power another set of wheels like the Herbst TT with 850hp hammering at it he'd be pulling his hair out trying to figure out how to make it live.

Dave

"I know it all, but I can't remember most of it..."
 
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