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BITD and class M Truck

raubracing

Member
V2R would be a good one for the big truck. The short course would be a good shake down. But like said above it would be all chopped up with woops.
And then there is BAJA. De Rooy raced the 500 a few years back, he pulled out, I hear he had a surgery a week before and it was to much or him. But they had passed all the 7S trucks by then.
I called BITD and they are talking amongst themselves. I believe the question was going to the Tech guy to see what he has to say.
 

trailready

Well-Known Member
SilverState 300 first, then V2R if you enjoyed that. please take sportsman rear start for SS300 cause there is nearly no passing and you are going to make a ton of dust :)
 

scootin newton

Well-Known Member
Also BITD has a age restriction on drivers and co drivers I believe. 14 and up for co drivers if I remember right. Unless your RG's kid of course lol.
they just let an 11 year old do it in a single seater... all that is required now is rich parents... cause obviously if your parents have money, you automatically are a fast, safe driver...
 

J Prich

Well-Known Member
they just let an 11 year old do it in a single seater... all that is required now is rich parents... cause obviously if your parents have money, you automatically are a fast, safe driver...
Probably worthy of a whole other conversation to keep from derailing the intent of the OP here....but imagine trying to do PR damage control to the world outside of our community if something happened in a mid level or major race involving a child driving or even being an occupant in a race vehicle. The optics alone would be devastating.
 

Ty Owings

Well-Known Member
they just let an 11 year old do it in a single seater... all that is required now is rich parents... cause obviously if your parents have money, you automatically are a fast, safe driver...
Sad lol. I tried to co-drive with my dad when I was 12 and was denied in the UTV class lol. Needless to say, still haven't gotten to co-drive even at 17 and volunteering with teams lol. Did get a ride in the smiley truck at testing though lol.
 

scootin newton

Well-Known Member
Probably worthy of a whole other conversation to keep from derailing the intent of the OP here....but imagine trying to do PR damage control to the world outside of our community if something happened in a mid level or major race involving a child driving or even being an occupant in a race vehicle. The optics alone would be devastating.
its a matter of time
 

MTPyle

Well-Known Member
There was a big truck that raced SADR last year. I think there was actually two big trucks. One of them was kind of a sweeper but I think the other one raced. They moved prettt good and blew a lot of black smoke. It was cool to watch.

Mike
 

51rcr

Well-Known Member
we have beat through it all in a vintage scrambler. leaf springs and 4 regular shocks and finished it all. so dont let them scare ya away. just a bigger challange. Look what Moss bros are racing and there finish rate.
first beat it around up there. then a trip to the desert for some race course type testing. then a bigger lap race with desert in it. Then a chase race. Then the 1000. Oshkosh is from up there. get them excited.
 

51rcr

Well-Known Member
i hate to derail it any further but i have to say 40 years ago i was that kid racing go carts with adults (we werent racing kids classes, those didnt exist) on up through the different circle track classes. So was a few other kids at the same time. we all raced bigger cars and all way before ages they said ya would have to be now. One died in a big crash at 20 years old (he had raced for 11 years by then) that took out most of the field. I was lucky I have also seen lots of other kids also and know of a few now doing it before the "age". I have also raced and participated kids and relized iam now the old guy. I tell yeah it is awesome to do and think i was that kid at one time and to see motorsports still have youth. Go out to a moto cross track and watch all the kids watching out trying to avoid the of age people that cant ride. Iam one of the first to speak up for a kid with talent. Usually over all the years the few that didnt like the kids were the ones that couldnt handle getting beat by one. I personally think its neat to get beat by one.
This isnt about money and all. Its about talent and skills and others vouching for there skills that have ran with them and seen how they drive. There is lots of kids and adults that shouldnt be able to drive anything. Since Max was mentioned. Hes got the skills to help keep kids being able to still drive early. He is to other skilled kids like Jeff Gordon was to me when i seen an article in dirt wheels about him since he was a few years older. Luckly this can still happen with kids.
The driver size and age and size of vehicle crashing into a crowd or people doesnt matter if its someone thats 11 or 55. Its still bad and happens. Fans have way more trust in equipment then i would have and am surprised there hasnt been whole crowds wiped out on a fast section.
If i knew there was a kid racing i would trust them way before most of the others. I know there there cause they couldnt just go buy a car and were going to race.
 

Moss2

Well-Known Member
The truck in my avatar is a '06 GMC Topkick C5500 4x4. LBZ duramax / Allison trans. Its currently on 46" xml tires, wheelbase is 216" or so. We used to "work it" but now the wife runs it a mile across town daily and its more of a toy then anything.

Drivetrain, wheelbase would remain more or less oem. Engine and trans upgrades, both are fresh currently.

It has a front solid axle dana "super" 70 .....which is question #2, is it (4wd) needed / warranted or would ditching the front drive axle for a 2wd and IFS be ideal.

Or maybe the question should be; based off my plan of attack ( not trying to compete with Oshkosh Truck)

If it was yours, would you leave the solid axle setup alone and make the best of it?

I'll be contacting BITD by phone today, otherwise It maybe a vintage f100.

My co-pilot will be my 11 year old son.
With that wheelbase and lots of weight I think you definitely will want to keep working 4 wheel drive. Let the organizer know your height before you show up so they can figure workarounds for low underpasses etc.
 

Bro_Gill

Well-Known Member
I have driven plenty of midsized 4wd trucks off road. Keep the 4wd, you will need it. Get that thing stuck with only 2wd and you might need a dozer to get you out. Trying to compare NORRA to anything else is wrong too. At NORRA, you may have a better run because they design tracks for vehicles more in line with yours, don't allow prerunning, and, for the most part, try to avoid the San Felipe style whoops and north of Vegas type silt beds. Expect to need to keep a 25mph average if you even dream of finishing in a time limit. I get it, you probably watched some Dakar and now think this would be cool. The routes on Dakar are long, but they do not have the rough that western Desert Racing has. Endurance is different than Trophy Truck suspension.
 

Bro_Gill

Well-Known Member
they just let an 11 year old do it in a single seater... all that is required now is rich parents... cause obviously if your parents have money, you automatically are a fast, safe driver...
There were 14 'kids' age 15 or under racing that race. And it appears none of them were killed or maimed. Many not of rich parents. Your point here?
 

scootin newton

Well-Known Member
There were 14 'kids' age 15 or under racing that race. And it appears none of them were killed or maimed. Many not of rich parents. Your point here?
First its just my opinion. Second I believe its a huge liability for our sport. As if the whole more crash wasn't bad enough, imagine if were a 12 year old kid driving?!? I just think letting kids drive is a bad idea.
 

Ty Owings

Well-Known Member
First its just my opinion. Second I believe its a huge liability for our sport. As if the whole more crash wasn't bad enough, imagine if were a 12 year old kid driving?!? I just think letting kids drive is a bad idea.
Not adding fuel to the fire at all. But, when I wanted to start racing in the old UTV class (800cc?) I was denied because I was not atleast 14 years old. The rule should stay the same no matter who your parents are or how much money or experience they have. The WORCS series was not around at the time (I wish it was). Really the only thing that was ok for me to race was the trophykarts at the regional races. But with our finances it was not in our budget to race every weekend like they do. Now, 5 years later, I think that not driving was a good decision for me. I'm more eager than ever to learn how to keep these trucks and buggy's running and as I matured I learned how to read terrain much better and how to actually drive the car hard without ripping the thing apart. I spent much of my time out in the desert riding dirtbikes and driving our prerunner buggy. Now i'm volunteering on many of the bigger race teams just to get the experience and to learn from the "elders" like rick and corey geiser. I'm still hoping to hop in a car this season as I've finally learned enough to fix most parts of the car. I've got notebooks full of notes from tire changes, to pit prep, to pulling engines and transmissions.
 

raubracing

Member
i hate to derail it any further but i have to say 40 years ago i was that kid racing go carts with adults (we werent racing kids classes, those didnt exist) on up through the different circle track classes. So was a few other kids at the same time. we all raced bigger cars and all way before ages they said ya would have to be now. One died in a big crash at 20 years old (he had raced for 11 years by then) that took out most of the field. I was lucky I have also seen lots of other kids also and know of a few now doing it before the "age". I have also raced and participated kids and relized iam now the old guy. I tell yeah it is awesome to do and think i was that kid at one time and to see motorsports still have youth. Go out to a moto cross track and watch all the kids watching out trying to avoid the of age people that cant ride. Iam one of the first to speak up for a kid with talent. Usually over all the years the few that didnt like the kids were the ones that couldnt handle getting beat by one. I personally think its neat to get beat by one.
This isnt about money and all. Its about talent and skills and others vouching for there skills that have ran with them and seen how they drive. There is lots of kids and adults that shouldnt be able to drive anything. Since Max was mentioned. Hes got the skills to help keep kids being able to still drive early. He is to other skilled kids like Jeff Gordon was to me when i seen an article in dirt wheels about him since he was a few years older. Luckly this can still happen with kids.
The driver size and age and size of vehicle crashing into a crowd or people doesnt matter if its someone thats 11 or 55. Its still bad and happens. Fans have way more trust in equipment then i would have and am surprised there hasnt been whole crowds wiped out on a fast section.
If i knew there was a kid racing i would trust them way before most of the others. I know there there cause they couldnt just go buy a car and were going to race.
I highly doubt they will let him drive. He is 11 .... we had a hell of a time renting mountain sleds in Wyoming a few weeks ago, but in the end they did let him ride his own. We run a small company that deals with welding/fab and the transportation industry. He operates all of our heavy equipment, races mx and snocross. Plows the driveway with the dump truck and all of our transport rigs are 65'+ long that he will back in, move etc
With that wheelbase and lots of weight I think you definitely will want to keep working 4 wheel drive. Let the organizer know your height before you show up so they can figure workarounds for low underpasses etc.
Well, I can get it thru the 9' drive thru at McD's!

I'm glad you said to keep the 4wd. I'd like to keep the solid axle under it... he's kinda heavy
 

51rcr

Well-Known Member
now if ya knew someone or someone vouched for him that would have been easier. Now they can be your referral for more rentals and your good. Always have to remember how many kids cant do a damn thing and people do the oh yeah my kids the best ever. haha.
Just need others to vouch for him. One of my buddies kids has been racing a full size fj80 land cruiser and won some and is quick and good driver. He rides as his co driver. I think he was 10 at his first race with the landcruiser.
 

raubracing

Member
First its just my opinion. Second I believe its a huge liability for our sport. As if the whole more crash wasn't bad enough, imagine if were a 12 year old kid driving?!? I just think letting kids drive is a bad idea.
Is it more so people of inadequate skill your concerned about? or actually smaller individuals?

Someone who grew up and I mean from little (3-4 years old) may potentially ( for arguments sake) have MORE experience operating "whatever" then a 16-18-50 year old person walking into motorsports.

In the past racing I have done in various spectrums, there have been ways to prove your ability... age aside.

Road racing sport bikes for example requires a weekend "track day" school with a mock race to end and get your entry level amateur license.

Not trying be argumentative l
I have driven plenty of midsized 4wd trucks off road. Keep the 4wd, you will need it. Get that thing stuck with only 2wd and you might need a dozer to get you out. Trying to compare NORRA to anything else is wrong too. At NORRA, you may have a better run because they design tracks for vehicles more in line with yours, don't allow prerunning, and, for the most part, try to avoid the San Felipe style whoops and north of Vegas type silt beds. Expect to need to keep a 25mph average if you even dream of finishing in a time limit. I get it, you probably watched some Dakar and now think this would be cool. The routes on Dakar are long, but they do not have the rough that western Desert Racing has. Endurance is different than Trophy Truck suspension.
Actually, I've never watched Dakar other then 15 mins the other night, just coincidence that. Oshkosh Truck is 15 miles from my house, and when I worked their they were rolling around in some of those test vehicles. I don't know the difference between NORRA or BITD and I don't believe I ever compared or commented on them. I saw the KOH televised / internet and more recently saw the V2R.

If stock vw bugs can compete, I figured I could handle it my truck.

I have nothing to compare this type of racing to. I have rented jeeps in Moab, I've taken my hotshot rigs into the high desert ripping down gravel sand roads for nothing more because I could.

I want to run this truck, build this truck because I can. I want to race because I grew up racing, I have a fairly diversified background in racing, as does my 11 year old.

I want to race it because for the pure joy of racing.

I get it, I'm new to the site with a big idea about a big truck. Truth is BITD hasn't approved it.
I thought I came in here, fully upfront of my lack of desert experience.

Just trying to learn and ask questions
 

51rcr

Well-Known Member
awhile back i remember something about a dakar truck running a race. Holes are alot smaller with a 54" tire. I think ya should go for it.
 

raubracing

Member
Sorry for so many replies, we had tv/internet outages here multiple times. Go to hit reply and nothing guess it posts it after the fact?

think I repeated myself few times over replies!
 

Bro_Gill

Well-Known Member
First, you can never compare a big truck with a class 11. This shows how far off the mark you are with the idea. I have driven 22,000+ pound trucks off road since 1988, 2wd, 4wd, etc... I know what the capabilities are even when modified for off road use. The courses raced out west are not gravel roads, The whoop sections will absolutely cause you to crawl for hours due to weight and lack of wheel travel. It's just what it is. Oshkosh spent millions of dollars and thousands and thousands of hours to try and get some of their best trucks to finish a Baja 1000 and couldn't do it. It's just the weight and lack of wheel travel available with that type of vehicle. I would love to see you race something, but in this case, I think you should look at something else.
 

raubracing

Member
First, you can never compare a big truck with a class 11. This shows how far off the mark you are with the idea. I have driven 22,000+ pound trucks off road since 1988, 2wd, 4wd, etc... I know what the capabilities are even when modified for off road use. The courses raced out west are not gravel roads, The whoop sections will absolutely cause you to crawl for hours due to weight and lack of wheel travel. It's just what it is. Oshkosh spent millions of dollars and thousands and thousands of hours to try and get some of their best trucks to finish a Baja 1000 and couldn't do it. It's just the weight and lack of wheel travel available with that type of vehicle. I would love to see you race something, but in this case, I think you should look at something else.
[/QUOTE

I can appreciate the pessimism. You've been there, you've done it all.... got it!
 

43mod

Well-Known Member
short course/mx/trophy cart and the like are fine for little boys and girls. In the big bad desert I don't think you can rely on a little kid to be able to do the things needed when the s hits the fan. I do get it that they can learn to be extremely capable drivers at those ages. There is a lot more to it than driving .
 
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