Class 5 only

[Ajam1]

I have an issues with Steering!

Maybe you all have had this issue.
I just bought all new from Howe the 2.5 Diablo power rack with control valve attached. New Howe Pump, new Howe reservoir W/ filter/ New lines, fittings.. everything. I have bleed and bleed and bleed the system. No air bubbles in the res at ALL.

With car idling and sitting on the ground, it steers nice and easy, no issues. However, when I drive it and need to turn quickly it gets super stiff and I can't steer it. almost crashed the car actually.

Took rack off and took it to the manufacturer, it checks out. No issues.
Took everything loose and re-bled the system. same issue.
I keep thinking its either air in the system I can't seem to get out or some type of restriction.

My next step is to sent the pump and control valve back to Howe. BTW Jeff at Howe has been awesome in trying to help me. Just thought maybe someone on here has had same issue before.

 

[swiftracing5]

I have an issues with Steering!

Maybe you all have had this issue.
I just bought all new from Howe the 2.5 Diablo power rack with control valve attached. New Howe Pump, new Howe reservoir W/ filter/ New lines, fittings.. everything. I have bleed and bleed and bleed the system. No air bubbles in the res at ALL.

With car idling and sitting on the ground, it steers nice and easy, no issues. However, when I drive it and need to turn quickly it gets super stiff and I can't steer it. almost crashed the car actually.

Took rack off and took it to the manufacturer, it checks out. No issues.
Took everything loose and re-bled the system. same issue.
I keep thinking its either air in the system I can't seem to get out or some type of restriction.

My next step is to sent the pump and control valve back to Howe. BTW Jeff at Howe has been awesome in trying to help me. Just thought maybe someone on here has had same issue before.

Hmmm... could be the joints in your steering rod are not aligned properly. It’s like CVs, you don’t want the joints to be clocked the exact same. Need to be offset 90*.
Other thing is maybe you are getting weird spikes in pressure under load If you’re jumping hose sizes on your system.
I have had the issue of aligning the joints, more than anything it was just hard to keep the wheel smooth, kept wanting to flick left or right.
Any pics of your system?

 

[JLongo]

Nice video Ben, car seems to be working good even after the rollover!

I have the same steering set up but run the Honda where the pump is driven off a separate belt. My steering gets stif in the low RPMs, like if you come in a corner to hot and give a little to much brake. I just made the switch at Parker and need to dig into why. Yours seems to be the opposite which is strange.On the bleeding, a couple of lock to lock turns of the wheel and she’s usually good.

We are keeping ourselves busy with new belly pans & engine covers. I’ll post pictures when completed

 

[michael.gonzalez]

What if you get up to speed, clutch in and bring the engine to idle while rolling 50+mph and see if steering is the same or better?

 

[Zac Reish]

I crashed at the mint with what you're describing in your steering system. I was unfortunately going 80 plus mph. Car swapped out on a smooth power line road I corrected 1 time and could not physically turn the wheel fast enough as it felt like it ran out of power assist. I remember grunting trying to muscle it as I started to roll. I didnt initially put 2 and 2 together and didnt know how the hell I was able to crash where I did. I didnt want to make an excuse like my steering wouldnt turn right after the crash. Even my navigator was like what happened? I said I don't know. Fast forward 7 months later and I'm pre running in baja and I slide around a corner swap out again, go to re correct and completely spin out. I was going 30 miles an hour. Same thing navigator. What was that. Steering basically locked up. He then drove the car and it happend to him on similar terrain. I replaced the power steering pump and the problem went away. The pump had less than 200 miles on it when I crashed it. That sucked. Last pump was good for over 2000 miles and i started to feel the heavy wheel again when quickly correcting on fire roads. I have since replaced it. Try a different pump.

 

[Ajam1]

I crashed at the mint with what you're describing in your steering system. I was unfortunately going 80 plus mph. Car swapped out on a smooth power line road I corrected 1 time and could not physically turn the wheel fast enough as it felt like it ran out of power assist. I remember grunting trying to muscle it as I started to roll. I didnt initially put 2 and 2 together and didnt know how the hell I was able to crash where I did. I didnt want to make an excuse like my steering wouldnt turn right after the crash. Even my navigator was like what happened? I said I don't know. Fast forward 7 months later and I'm pre running in baja and I slide around a corner swap out again, go to re correct and completely spin out. I was going 30 miles an hour. Same thing navigator. What was that. Steering basically locked up. He then drove the car and it happend to him on similar terrain. I replaced the power steering pump and the problem went away. The pump had less than 200 miles on it when I crashed it. That sucked. Last pump was good for over 2000 miles and i started to feel the heavy wheel again when quickly correcting on fire roads. I have since replaced it. Try a different pump.

That’s exactly the case. It definitely feels like it’s hydraulic. Like not enough pressure or flow. Everything is brand new 0 miles. 1,500 psi pump with the small control valve on it. It’s like it’s not flowing enough. I initially thought it was a air in the system problem. But I think I have rules that out. I’m confident it’s not a hardware/ set up issue.

 

[Zac Reish]

Easiest way to fix a problem is throwing new parts at it. What happened to the top beam tube?

 

[Ajam1]

Easiest way to fix a problem is throwing new parts at it. What happened to the top beam tube?

The Baja shop built the car in like 05-06? It’s turned down .. roughly turned .. not sure why.

 

[dhjeepgeek]

My beam is like that too, It was turned down to make it thicker than 120 wall but thinner than 250 wall. Like a tweener.

 

[swiftracing5]

@Ajam1 can you post a pic of the pump area?
A buddy told me to check pulley diameter and make sure the feed line at the pump is larger, I think -10 on our cars whereas everything else is -8.

 

[Ajam1]

@Ajam1 can you post a pic of the pump area?
A buddy told me to check pulley diameter and make sure the feed line at the pump is larger, I think -10 on our cars whereas everything else is -8.

I do not. However, the feed line/return from reservoir to pump is -10. Pressure line is -6 and return from control valve/Servo to reservoir is -8
The torsion bar in control valve/Servo is 200.
1,500 psi TC pump, 3.5 gpm @ 1,700 rpm 5.5 gpm @ 4,000 rpm.
I do not know what the GPM on the control valve/Servo is.

 

[JLongo]

Just wanted to show off the great work RPM did for the 5 car. Highly recommend Richard , little bit of a drive for me but well worth it!

 

[Class10DAN]

On our way to NORRA.... Class 5 old schoolView attachment 117374

ok this is an amazing looking car (sorry Zac, yours is cool too) but i want to know what happened to it. is it still under the same owner or has it been moved around?

 

[Dustinose]

what size rims are guys running with the 35 10.5 and 33 10.5 tires? 15x4?

 

[Kirk_Babbington]

I do not. However, the feed line/return from reservoir to pump is -10. Pressure line is -6 and return from control valve/Servo to reservoir is -8
The torsion bar in control valve/Servo is 200.
1,500 psi TC pump, 3.5 gpm @ 1,700 rpm 5.5 gpm @ 4,000 rpm.
I do not know what the GPM on the control valve/Servo is.

Since I wanted to run 35” tires on my 10 car, I was told to run my system with the servo in line, not attached to the rack itself. Did not get a reason for this, but it was what was told to me by a couple of prep guys.

 

[M.Harvey1600]

I have an issues with Steering!

Maybe you all have had this issue.
I just bought all new from Howe the 2.5 Diablo power rack with control valve attached. New Howe Pump, new Howe reservoir W/ filter/ New lines, fittings.. everything. I have bleed and bleed and bleed the system. No air bubbles in the res at ALL.

With car idling and sitting on the ground, it steers nice and easy, no issues. However, when I drive it and need to turn quickly it gets super stiff and I can't steer it. almost crashed the car actually.

Took rack off and took it to the manufacturer, it checks out. No issues.
Took everything loose and re-bled the system. same issue.
I keep thinking its either air in the system I can't seem to get out or some type of restriction.

My next step is to sent the pump and control valve back to Howe. BTW Jeff at Howe has been awesome in trying to help me. Just thought maybe someone on here has had same issue before.

I crashed at the mint with what you're describing in your steering system. I was unfortunately going 80 plus mph. Car swapped out on a smooth power line road I corrected 1 time and could not physically turn the wheel fast enough as it felt like it ran out of power assist. I remember grunting trying to muscle it as I started to roll. I didnt initially put 2 and 2 together and didnt know how the hell I was able to crash where I did. I didnt want to make an excuse like my steering wouldnt turn right after the crash. Even my navigator was like what happened? I said I don't know. Fast forward 7 months later and I'm pre running in baja and I slide around a corner swap out again, go to re correct and completely spin out. I was going 30 miles an hour. Same thing navigator. What was that. Steering basically locked up. He then drove the car and it happend to him on similar terrain. I replaced the power steering pump and the problem went away. The pump had less than 200 miles on it when I crashed it. That sucked. Last pump was good for over 2000 miles and i started to feel the heavy wheel again when quickly correcting on fire roads. I have since replaced it. Try a different pump.

That’s exactly the case. It definitely feels like it’s hydraulic. Like not enough pressure or flow. Everything is brand new 0 miles. 1,500 psi pump with the small control valve on it. It’s like it’s not flowing enough. I initially thought it was a air in the system problem. But I think I have rules that out. I’m confident it’s not a hardware/ set up issue.

I do not. However, the feed line/return from reservoir to pump is -10. Pressure line is -6 and return from control valve/Servo to reservoir is -8
The torsion bar in control valve/Servo is 200.
1,500 psi TC pump, 3.5 gpm @ 1,700 rpm 5.5 gpm @ 4,000 rpm.
I do not know what the GPM on the control valve/Servo is.

A steering guru buddy of mine that I worked alongside doing steering components(he was the rack and pump master) suggests opening up the flow control valve. He said it sounds as though the fluid is being restricted. A #1 machinist drill bit will do the trick. Flow control is the fitting on the pressure side of the pump, careful there is piston and spring in the port that will want to spring out.

 

[swiftracing5]

ok this is an amazing looking car (sorry Zac, yours is cool too) but i want to know what happened to it. is it still under the same owner or has it been moved around?

I know Tom has another 5 car that is still racing here and there, I saw it at Jakes recently. It's possible it is the same car just with a makeover but don't quote me.

@Dustinose I have always been either 5.5 or 6, since Method and Proam did not make the same width on my 35s. Helps spread the tread out and limits the amount of sidewall flex.

 

[Ajam1]

A steering guru buddy of mine that I worked alongside doing steering components(he was the rack and pump master) suggests opening up the flow control valve. He said it sounds as though the fluid is being restricted. A #1 machinist drill bit will do the trick. Flow control is the fitting on the pressure side of the pump, careful there is piston and spring in the port that will want to spring out.

So where I'm at now is.... I've talked to Howe, I've talked to SWEET (Servo manufacturer) and they both tell me the same thing, the large inline servo and the "light weight" servo have the exact same specs, same flow ect. The large servo is old tech and will be harder to get at some point. The Light weight servo is the new tech. SWEET along with other steering manufacturers have TONS of servos attached to the racks. So not sure if that's an issue or not.

I have two brand new TC pumps. The one thing I haven't done is swap pumps to see if I maybe have a bad pump. It's new so I hadn't thought about swapping pumps.

I have also talked to a prep guy (he does it for a living) that I completely trust and we have talked about flow control, in addition to changing the torsion bar in the servo to a 185. So I'm going to change pumps this weekend and see If we still have the same issue. If so, then I'll send everything back to Howe and have him test everything. I obviously have a gremlin some place that's not "normal". My fear is Howe will tell me there's nothing wrong with the parts..... At that point I'd have to go to another steering "Guru"
Thanks for all the help guys, once I get it figured out I'll let everyone know.

 

[bhernquist]

So where I'm at now is.... I've talked to Howe, I've talked to SWEET (Servo manufacturer) and they both tell me the same thing, the large inline servo and the "light weight" servo have the exact same specs, same flow ect. The large servo is old tech and will be harder to get at some point. The Light weight servo is the new tech. SWEET along with other steering manufacturers have TONS of servos attached to the racks. So not sure if that's an issue or not.

I have two brand new TC pumps. The one thing I haven't done is swap pumps to see if I maybe have a bad pump. It's new so I hadn't thought about swapping pumps.

I have also talked to a prep guy (he does it for a living) that I completely trust and we have talked about flow control, in addition to changing the torsion bar in the servo to a 185. So I'm going to change pumps this weekend and see If we still have the same issue. If so, then I'll send everything back to Howe and have him test everything. I obviously have a gremlin some place that's not "normal". My fear is Howe will tell me there's nothing wrong with the parts..... At that point I'd have to go to another steering "Guru"
Thanks for all the help guys, once I get it figured out I'll let everyone know.

I've worked with Jeff since his days at UMP when they were the P/S Gurus and long before starting his own business. I know he'll always get to bottom of any problem with his stuff. Don't worry about him telling you there's nothing wrong with his parts and not wanting to get your problem fixed if there's another issue with the system. Just make sure you get him all of the things he needs to figure it out...

 

[M.Harvey1600]

So where I'm at now is.... I've talked to Howe, I've talked to SWEET (Servo manufacturer) and they both tell me the same thing, the large inline servo and the "light weight" servo have the exact same specs, same flow ect. The large servo is old tech and will be harder to get at some point. The Light weight servo is the new tech. SWEET along with other steering manufacturers have TONS of servos attached to the racks. So not sure if that's an issue or not.

I have two brand new TC pumps. The one thing I haven't done is swap pumps to see if I maybe have a bad pump. It's new so I hadn't thought about swapping pumps.

I have also talked to a prep guy (he does it for a living) that I completely trust and we have talked about flow control, in addition to changing the torsion bar in the servo to a 185. So I'm going to change pumps this weekend and see If we still have the same issue. If so, then I'll send everything back to Howe and have him test everything. I obviously have a gremlin some place that's not "normal". My fear is Howe will tell me there's nothing wrong with the parts..... At that point I'd have to go to another steering "Guru"
Thanks for all the help guys, once I get it figured out I'll let everyone know.

I dont think you have a bad pump. the PSI in a pump is 1 thing the GPM is what you need to push the larger/heavier tires. opening up the flow control can increase the GPM. I would look at the flow control in the new pump before you switch it out. drill it out if need be and install that drilled out flow control on the pump that is in the car.