Class 9 Minimum weights...Fair? Reasonable?

Jeffers909

Well-Known Member
Title says it all...MORE or SNORE hasn't weighed a 2 seat 9 car that weighed under 1500lbs in recent memory. Why is that?

Building a car "questionably" light, running the smallest, lightest parts, finding the lightest rider, no GPS, no radio, no nothing basically...2.5 internal bypass rears...definitely not, all to try and get your 2 seat 9 car at a competitive weight. These are things racers should be doing to gain an advantage over other cars, not too just be competitive against the single seat cars. And all that said and done, take wind drag into account and a 1350lb 2 seat car with a 100lb rider will most likely loose in a heads up drag race. Is that really fair? Am I missing something...Why did 1600 get rid of the 1350lb min weight rule for 2 seat cars?

Personally, I think its time for Class 9 to follow suit: 1500 lb minimum weight, restrictor plate for single seat cars.

Its been about a year since there was a good heated debate on the swinger forum, lets start another one...
 

Grease Weed

Well-Known Member
I totally agree. It's time to examine this a little closer. I have a two seat. With the bear minimum(no radios, GPS) running everything else that all the cars run. It weights in at 1436. That's why I remove the seat and add weight to run as a single seat. Let's even the playing field.
 

Bro_Gill

Well-Known Member
Strange, lots of 2 seat cars used to win in the desert. But then again, 3 our of 5 people who receive gov't assistance are obese. Wonder how those who make enough to race eat?
 

Mohr

Well-Known Member
My car was 1385 race ready....but I didn't have reservoirs on the rear...I only saw 1 car lighter, and the frame was toast after 1 year...I don't have a dog in this fight, but I think they should bump both weights by 50 lbs....that should bring things back into perspective...
 

T_Petersen

Well-Known Member
I feel one weight should be created. Weigh cars as they race with driver/rider, tool bags, spares... Everything has to be properly mounted and strapped in.

The more you weigh as a person the lighter your car can be.

Maybe set the weight at 1800 lbs.


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Grease Weed

Well-Known Member
I've had two single seats, had to add weight to both. It is strange that 2 seat cars USED to be competitive. 2.0 shocks, no reservoirs, stock pedal assembly's.
Why is it that you don't see any( maybe one or two) more 2 seat cars? Because you are starting the race at a disadvantage. Weight is your enemy.
Do something to bring back the two seat cars. Larger car counts= a win,win.
 

mdepue

Well-Known Member
I've had two single seats, had to add weight to both. It is strange that 2 seat cars USED to be competitive. 2.0 shocks, no reservoirs, stock pedal assembly's.
Why is it that you don't see any( maybe one or two) more 2 seat cars? Because you are starting the race at a disadvantage. Weight is your enemy.
Do something to bring back the two seat cars. Larger car counts= a win,win.
In my eyes the two seater is still just as competitive, last year a single seat won 3 races and two seat won 3 races. In fact the more duel in the desert had 15 cars and a two seater won, rage at the river second largest car count with 13 a singles seater won and the third largest car count freedom 250 had 11 cars and a 2 seater won.

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Bro_Gill

Well-Known Member
In my eyes the two seater is still just as competitive, last year a single seat won 3 races and two seat won 3 races. In fact the more duel in the desert had 15 cars and a two seater won, rage at the river second largest car count with 13 a singles seater won and the third largest car count freedom 250 had 11 cars and a 2 seater won.

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Gasp! Can't be true! Did you read the first post???
 

Grease Weed

Well-Known Member
mdepue, since you're building s/s cars. Why not build a 2 seat race ready at 1350?
Bro Gill do you currently race 9? No? Ok then.
 

Grease Weed

Well-Known Member
I don't give a crap where it's sitting. You said a mouth full, it's sitting. And my question to bro gill was does he currently race nine. If you don't race the class, we don't need your input!
 

mrmatt

Well-Known Member
My old 2 seater weighed in the neighborhood of 1450ish. Was not sxore tagable. My current 2 seat car weighs 1502. It is score tagable. I do have a GPS in the car that I could live with out and I would be just under 1500.
I know that I could change out hydraulic clutch and some other items to save some weight...but I would definitely not be able to shed 150 lbs.
When this car was built it was a little lighter but we had add some things like heavier skid plate because the lighter weight one didn't make it through 2 races. We had to add some gussets here and there to strengthen some things because after one race it was evident that we could not save weight on certain things. I have pondered cutting all the webbing out and use 1"...but not going too.
The point of all that is....I do not think a safe, reliable 2 seat at 1350 is really feasible....I think if u go without some comforts and really pay attention to some things 1400-1420 is realistic.
Do I feel like I am at a disadvantage of the line....yes. However I did choose to build a 2 seat car. Did we attempt to make it as light as possible, yes. However there were some items that I did want to skimp on or change so some o my weigh is my own fault.
Are 2 seats competitive... Yes! I have won a couple over the last 2 years, Brandon heald, Kyle vizzo, Brian Caudill have all won recently in 2 seaters.
But yes, I do feel that a single seat has an advantage right off the bat.


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T_Petersen

Well-Known Member
Something needs to be changed, but a restrictor plate is not the solution. I feel is hurt the 1600 class if anything.

Matching weights with driver/rider would make for an equal battle. Arrow dynamics are only good for top speed straights during races.


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mrmatt

Well-Known Member
I agree...I don't like the restrictor plate

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Grease Weed

Well-Known Member
How long has class9/ challenger been around? 30+years. When 9 started and the weights were set, all the cars used stock LIGHTER Vw parts. As the class has evolved we've made the cars heavier. Saco racks, 3 master cylinders, radios, Gps, 2.0 and 2.5 shocks with reservoirs etc.
I agree, no restrictor plate. The only reason it works in 1600 is because of the compression their pumping.
Not on a basically stock motor.
I agree with Tyler, a weight that includes the driver. What that weight is, I don't know.
The single seat cars are probably going to fight it, who wants to give up an advantage.
I'd like to see a return to the days of 20-30 cars at some of these races.
 

Mike Depue

Well-Known Member
Honestly I don't think anyone can truly say they lost because they were in a 2 seater I think the rules are ok as they are you can build a 2 seat car light enough and strong enough if you try.

Adding weight to cars in not a good idea we all know the week link in a 9 car is transmission.

Restrictor plates are a bad idea be cause it will cause a major disadvantage for sure for singles.
Just like 1600

The 2 seat cars that I have built are around 1500 but not because I couldn't make them lighter but because I built them to last and on a budget and there mild steel with a lot of .120 wall tubbing and holding up well, with chromolly I could have used all .95 and some .065 in places and shaved a lot of weight and not lost strength.

So I say leave it alone if you feel your at a disadvantage in a 2 seater go out and get used to your car test, try everything within the rules you can think of to go faster prep it well and drive hard you will be surprised how much better you can get just by changing small things.

As a matter of fact if you wanna pull a hill faster put heavier tires on the rear

In the last few months I have worked on a couple different peoples shocks to find the valving was way off compared to what we run causing those cars to pack up and bounce and swap really bad within 2 hrs got one from going through whoops in 2nd gear to 4th comfortably without bucking around.



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Johnson954

Well-Known Member
My car was 1385 race ready....but I didn't have reservoirs on the rear...I only saw 1 car lighter, and the frame was toast after 1 year...I don't have a dog in this fight, but I think they should bump both weights by 50 lbs....that should bring things back into perspective...
I agree with Joel, I think 50lbs would help level out the field, however I am not a fan of restrictor plates. I will also go to my grave believing that running aluminum wheels would really help out the class. It would help all the cars reduce unsprung weight, making it easier on the transmission, help the 2-seaters get closer to the minimum weight, and would also help with sharing spares between classes. I believe the spun aluminum wheels are about 5lbs lighter a wheel than what we run now, so that could be close to 20lbs off the unsprung, and 10 lbs off the flywheel. I know price use to be a huge issue, but the USA Spun Aluminum wheels at Kartek are not that much more expensive. Check 'em out....USA Wheel Spun Aluminum Wheels 15" x 4", 2" offset - Kartek Off-Road
 

Grease Weed

Well-Known Member
Mike I agree with everything your saying as far as car setup. Prep is number 1. Dialing in your shocks an absolute must. These cars are fragile. But with all things being equal, a lighter car is a faster car. We are all looking for more speed. It's all about the power to weight ratio in ALL forms of motor sports.
 
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