Combining BITD classes

michael.gonzalez

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MG, have you seen any of the new class 3000 trucks that are being built? I have, they are not even close to entry level on any level.
Yes, I have seen the NEW ones but I'm not talking about brand-new top-of-the-line as previously stated.

And as far as Class 2000 goes, you don't need a V8 to win the championship, you don't even need a v6. Ask me how I know.
 

BRINGTHERUCKUS

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6100 and 6800 should combine in 2 years time to get the rest of the 6800 guys time to update to the big engine, keeping 2 classes of the same thing is dumb. Don't like the new higher priced engine package? should of fought harder when the class voted.

a combo 7S/8S/2000 class would be awesome. mini truck has a V6, full size V8. Keep some simple engine rules to keep things cheaper, I've seen what the sportsman classes in Crandon do for rules and I can see them working ok in the desert, or go "sealed" crate. Door Slammer, Bolt-on kit front, leaf rear go bounce around. But its racing and people would find a way to make it more expensive than it needs to be. To be fair, this idea is not new, however I really miss racing stock-ish trucks. Best part is its combining 3 classes, not adding one.
 

Bro_Gill

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MG- So your hoping some guys with backhalved Rangers take over Class 3000 in BITD? And when you have a class that allows everything to be built like a Trophy Truck, expect the folks who are serious about winning the class to build theirs that way and win. It is not an entry level class just like 1450 isn't really an entry level class anymore.
 

stephenrjking

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Mike, this is somewhat ground we've already trod on, but you're talking about TL as an entry-level truck class.

Obviously, it's a touch pricey. I'm curious: Do you think 1700 Jeepspeed is inappropriate as a leg toward truck racing? Obviously it's not IFS, but they are enclosed, relatively simple, and cheap. There's a truck that ran competitively this year selling for $21,000 right now. That's half the cheapest Trophylites.

Is it just performance potential? Obviously the 1700s aren't particularly fast, but I'm told that TLs aren't particularly fast either. Are we talking different levels of "not that fast?"

Not trying to pick a fight. I just look a Jeepspeed that, at $21k, is the sort of thing someone might buy instead of a boat or a travel trailer as a recreational expense--the sort of thing that's a lot more accessible as an entry-level option. Something that a guy with a good job and decent finances could say, "you know, a couple buddies and I could do that someday."

Are we just thinking it's too limited to be a first step toward a truck program?
 

MTPyle

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I love Jeepspeed and the few guys I have met have been super cool. The vehicles seem to be very different from each other. You get all sorts of stuff with a home built class.

they also seem like more going on to break with 4x4, etc. they are larger and heavier than a TL for sure. I have not been in one so I really have no idea what they are like.

TL is a spec class so you can show up and be close to the same speed. It’s not fast but fast enough to have a lot of fun. And there is less to break. It’s light, simple, and proven. Also cheaper to prep.

my buddy Dave Taylor has a Geiser TT, BajaLite 6100, and just bought a TLR4. He has only raced it one time but said it was the funnest race vehicle he has driven. Just wide open and massive smile the entire time. I think a spec class truck that’s not too fast can be a lot of fun to drive. And it’s also great to have a bunch of trucks all close to each other.

I don’t think you can go wrong with either. They are both entry level and cheaper to race.

Mike
 

michael.gonzalez

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MG- So your hoping some guys with backhalved Rangers take over Class 3000 in BITD? And when you have a class that allows everything to be built like a Trophy Truck, expect the folks who are serious about winning the class to build theirs that way and win. It is not an entry level class just like 1450 isn't really an entry level class anymore.
Absolutely not. Linked rangers belong in 1450.

Obviously, class 3000 is not the cheapest but a 1450 truck isn't cheap either.

You want a cheap truck? Class 2000
Truck that is a little faster and a little more expensive? 1450 or 3000 or even a 6000 (TL R4) truck
Truck that is quite a bit faster and quite a bit more expensive? 6100 or 6800 (TL R8)

That's the way I see it.
 

jeepspeedcom

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Interesting thread. Maybe jus a few guys posting but I bet there are a lot of lurkers watching. Jeepspeed was started by guys that had raced everything from Stock to Trophy Truck so our ideas are to make truck racing affordable. Its all about tire size and travel. Thats the way to reduce classes. Jeepspeed Class 1700 is 6 cyl 33" tire 10 and 12 travel. Class 2700 any Mopar motor 35" tire 12 and 14 travel. Class 3700 back halved trucks 37" tire open motor 15 and 24 travel. Class 4700 tube frame 123" wb 35" tire 18" front travel open motors and open rear travel. For sale on Race Dezert now...Class 1700 Champion $21K, Class 2700 Champion $36K. Both moving up to 4700.Ultra 4 Rock racer for 3700 $39K. Bunch of 1450 and Pro trucks around for Under $70K for 4700. All affordable for the thrill of racing. Past 1700 drivers now big time, Ray Griffith, Casey Currie, Todd Jackson and more. Its a great place to start. 2021 Jeepspeed series $850 entry fee at all BITD events plus payback. Thanks for listening. www.jeepspeed.com
 

MTPyle

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Thanks for the Jeepspeed info. Lots of great stuff there.

I thought 4700 was 37” tires?

love the pro trucks and glad they have a class to race in.

and yes lots of lurkers. Haha. I always get a lot of private messages from guys that read all of this but will never post. So even more reason to share lots of info.

Mike
 
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jeepspeedcom

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Thanks for the Jeepspeed info. Lots of great stuff there.

I thought 4700 was 37” tires?

love the pro trucks and glad they have a class to race in.

and yes lots of lurkers. Haha. I always get a lot of private messages from guys that read all of this but will never post. So even more reason to share lots of info.

Mike
Sorry...you are correct.....brain fade....37" open tire in 4700.
 

calstyl2

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Jeepspeed is the best entry class, low cost, great friendly racing, I recall at a Bluewater a few years ago a broke down JS in the sand, 2 other jeepspeeds bringing out ATF, throwing it out the window as they went by and flipping off the other team.............that was awesome
 

stephenrjking

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Interesting thread. Maybe jus a few guys posting but I bet there are a lot of lurkers watching. Jeepspeed was started by guys that had raced everything from Stock to Trophy Truck so our ideas are to make truck racing affordable. Its all about tire size and travel. Thats the way to reduce classes. Jeepspeed Class 1700 is 6 cyl 33" tire 10 and 12 travel. Class 2700 any Mopar motor 35" tire 12 and 14 travel. Class 3700 back halved trucks 37" tire open motor 15 and 24 travel. Class 4700 tube frame 123" wb 35" tire 18" front travel open motors and open rear travel. For sale on Race Dezert now...Class 1700 Champion $21K, Class 2700 Champion $36K. Both moving up to 4700.Ultra 4 Rock racer for 3700 $39K. Bunch of 1450 and Pro trucks around for Under $70K for 4700. All affordable for the thrill of racing. Past 1700 drivers now big time, Ray Griffith, Casey Currie, Todd Jackson and more. Its a great place to start. 2021 Jeepspeed series $850 entry fee at all BITD events plus payback. Thanks for listening. www.jeepspeed.com
So I was wondering about that, how do Ultra4s (I assume the rock racer you’re referring to is a 4500) correspond and/or how close to Jeepspeeds get to that? Obviously the use is completely different, but can a 4500 be competitive?

How close are different trucks in class in speed? Seems like they’re limited enough at 17 and 27 that you’re not going to get huge capability deltas.
 

J Prich

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Problem with 2000 is the motor rule. Big V8s in small trucks means lots of high dollars for other stuff. Defeats the purpose of entry level.
The decision to go open motor was a bummer to me too. They’ve gotten decent turnout over the years still, but I’m never been a fan of that rule.
 

J Prich

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speaking of 2000 I dont see many of those, especially in BITD. I think SNORE gets a couple each race. I didn't add that to my list of truck classes. But not sure BITD needs it.

Mike
2000 in SNORE would be 7100 in BITD. The reason you don’t see many in BITD is because its a legit entry level class and the guys building and racing those kinds of tricks generally aren’t game to pay twice as much entry to race BITD over SNORE.
 

ace_photo

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Just in the recent past TL has sent Messer, Williams, PJ, and others. Currently there are at least 3 other TL racers that are moving up to 6100/6800 this next season.

So although you may be right that historically 1600 has been a great feeder to bigger classes TL has had the most recent ones.

Its a different demographic. with the TL rental program they get a lot of guys with money and interest to get into the sport. Brenthal has also been very good at getting guys in with a rental program.

Not taking away from 1600, its cool for sure. But I would never race it, but I am 250lb's and 6'5" LOL

Mike
You're a funny guy.
 

misterktm

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I love Jeepspeed and the few guys I have met have been super cool. The vehicles seem to be very different from each other. You get all sorts of stuff with a home built class.

they also seem like more going on to break with 4x4, etc. they are larger and heavier than a TL for sure. I have not been in one so I really have no idea what they are like.

TL is a spec class so you can show up and be close to the same speed. It’s not fast but fast enough to have a lot of fun. And there is less to break. It’s light, simple, and proven. Also cheaper to prep.

my buddy Dave Taylor has a Geiser TT, BajaLite 6100, and just bought a TLR4. He has only raced it one time but said it was the funnest race vehicle he has driven. Just wide open and massive smile the entire time. I think a spec class truck that’s not too fast can be a lot of fun to drive. And it’s also great to have a bunch of trucks all close to each other.

I don’t think you can go wrong with either. They are both entry level and cheaper to race.

Mike
Not all the (1700) jeepspeeds are 4 wheel drive. In fact, some of the fastest have been 2 wheel drive (beams in the front). Our 1700 was configured for easy swapping between the beam and a dana 44 front diff. For the longer/silty races we ran the 4 wheel drive. The faster, shorter races we ran the 2 wheel drive beam. And we were much faster with the beam in it. Suspension worked way better with out the heavy front diff. There has been other wicked fast beam cars as well. Helgeson had a rocket 10 years ago, Jimmy Perry built a very fast beam car a couple years ago as well as several others.

As for breaking/reliability...the last year we ran 1700 (2019) we not only finished every mile of every race, we only got out of the truck one time the entire season , and that was to swap fuel lines to our back up pump. And we weren't putzing...we won every race.

Comparing speed to trophy light - we often physically caught the back markers in that class. We were not catching the front runners by any means - but in the end on corrected time, we were typically toward the font half that class. So they aren't that much faster than a solid 1700 car.

Lastly, the 1700 class jeeps are closer to each other than you might think. Sure chassis design's vary - but it's all tubes supporting a uni-body. The hard parts that make them go - suspension and running gear are all nearly identical. You can only do so much to a 4.0 liter engine, they are all very close in HP. It's a pretty level playing field.

Not knocking TL at all - seems to also be a great class...I just have a soft spot for 1700 and think it is the better entry class - especially if $'s is part of the criteria.

Also not knocking you Mike, I love reading your posts - and you are generally giving Jeepspeed good plugs - I just wanted to offer a few counters to your trophy light plug in this thread.
 

MTPyle

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Mister

thanks for the insight. Sounds like you guys had a n amazing season and a blast. That’s what this is all about.
I didn’t know you could switch the truck from 4x4 and back. That’s super cool.

fact is all classes give the opportunity to have a great experience.

Jeepspeed is a valuable asset to the sport. There are so many great stories and experiences thru out off-road racing. I learn more and more very day.

Mike
 

stephenrjking

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Not all the (1700) jeepspeeds are 4 wheel drive. In fact, some of the fastest have been 2 wheel drive (beams in the front). Our 1700 was configured for easy swapping between the beam and a dana 44 front diff. For the longer/silty races we ran the 4 wheel drive. The faster, shorter races we ran the 2 wheel drive beam. And we were much faster with the beam in it. Suspension worked way better with out the heavy front diff. There has been other wicked fast beam cars as well. Helgeson had a rocket 10 years ago, Jimmy Perry built a very fast beam car a couple years ago as well as several others.

As for breaking/reliability...the last year we ran 1700 (2019) we not only finished every mile of every race, we only got out of the truck one time the entire season , and that was to swap fuel lines to our back up pump. And we weren't putzing...we won every race.

Comparing speed to trophy light - we often physically caught the back markers in that class. We were not catching the front runners by any means - but in the end on corrected time, we were typically toward the font half that class. So they aren't that much faster than a solid 1700 car.

Lastly, the 1700 class jeeps are closer to each other than you might think. Sure chassis design's vary - but it's all tubes supporting a uni-body. The hard parts that make them go - suspension and running gear are all nearly identical. You can only do so much to a 4.0 liter engine, they are all very close in HP. It's a pretty level playing field.

Not knocking TL at all - seems to also be a great class...I just have a soft spot for 1700 and think it is the better entry class - especially if $'s is part of the criteria.

Also not knocking you Mike, I love reading your posts - and you are generally giving Jeepspeed good plugs - I just wanted to offer a few counters to your trophy light plug in this thread.
This is great stuff.
 

Red Ford Racer

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Mike
Please show us a NEW T/L R-4, I dont belive that one exists! I am very close to this as we are building parts to convert T/ls to class 3000 trucks. I have owned and raced everything from buggies, T/Ls, Superlite, stock full, 7200, TT spec and others but a T/L chassis with a wider track and a 325 h.p. Eco-boost gives you alot of bang for the buck!!
Come down to AZ and we can actually put you in one for a test drive.
MIKE
 

Fourstroker

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@misterktm you could probably include Ray Griffith in that super fast group. He pretty much dominated Jeepspeed over a 4 year period.

I love Jeepspeeds but when FAIR was still around and we were pitting the Jeepsppeders we used take bets about how many Jeepspeeds would come through our pits before we had to weld on one
 
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