Just add rain: COR Dirty City wrap

stephenrjking

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2015
Posts
573
Reaction
940
Location
Duluth, MN
Brief due to my time commitments: Wasn't there, livestream was excellent as usual, though I feel like overall we're getting fewer drone shots? Maybe it's just me.

The big story was, obviously, the pop-up thunderstorms that carved through the narrow slice of Wisconsin that included Lena and soaked the track Saturday. That turned the pro races that ran into mud bowls, with several Pro Lite trucks hilariously plowing straight through turns, their wheels in full lock, totally unable to rotate. And, of course, it delayed the Pro-2 and Pro-4 races to Sunday morning, which if I had been to the track would have been a bitter disappointment. Given one-day ticket holders free admission for Sunday isn't perfect, but it was a good impromptu choice for those who still might be in town.

Sunday's conditions and racing were good.

If I had just looked at the Pro Lite results, I wouldn't have known that Heger basically lucked into his wins. After all, he wins most of the time, but not usually the way it happened here, with trucks breaking and/or going off track in front of him.

Pro-2 has turned quite dramatic. The season opened with Brooks and Kincaid looking the two fastest, but both of them have had tough luck in some races (the most hilarious so far was when Brooks accidently drove straight off the track and onto the service lane at ERX) and Ryan Beat has snuck into the points lead. I feel bad for Cory Winner, who still doesn't have a win in the discipline despite being really fast. Ricky Gutierrez won in the morning session, and thus we already have 6 guys who have driven a Pro-2 to victory of some sort *this season* and Winner isn't one of them. Neither is Kyle Kleiman, the defending champion. Not all of the races are aesthetic masterpieces, but they are dramatic and there's no telling who is going to win when the flag drops.

Pro-4 is still the show, though of course it was never going to live up to the ERX races. Johnny Greaves and Leduc both got wins due to breakdowns in front of them. That's part of the business. One of the things that makes this kind of racing exciting is that drivers have to drive their trucks at the very limit of their mechanical tolerance to win, and so breakdowns happen, and that can mean moments like Mittag's last-lap collapse. Part of the game. Chaney and Henderson both look good on track, btw, which helps deepen the field even more.

Pro-Stock and Pro-Mod are both reasonably intriguing this year, btw. Multiple potential winners will do that. Smaller tracks seem better suited for what the UTVS can do.

Overall: Lena is a good stop. I found myself relieved that I didn't go Saturday.

Two weeks for Bark River. My schedule won't let me go, which is disappointing. But the racing will be spectacular.
 

Curtis Guise

Administrator
Joined
Mar 22, 2001
Posts
13,533
Reaction
4,930
Location
Oceanside, CA
Website
www.offroadaction.com
Thanks for posting these. I wasn't able to watch the livestream. A few weeks ago I reached out to COR's marketing person about trying to make the livestreams so they can be replayed after the races. She thought it was a great idea and reached out to that department and they told her that they didn't want to because they want people watching the races on their site. Doesn't make sense because any livestream can be posted on other sites just like I do here in the forum. It would get them more exposure and views if people could watch it again after the race is over no matter what site its on.
 

sb4pro

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 6, 2010
Posts
3,869
Reaction
3,227
Location
Buffalo New York
Thanks for posting these. I wasn't able to watch the livestream. A few weeks ago I reached out to COR's marketing person about trying to make the livestreams so they can be replayed after the races. She thought it was a great idea and reached out to that department and they told her that they didn't want to because they want people watching the races on their site. Doesn't make sense because any livestream can be posted on other sites just like I do here in the forum. It would get them more exposure and views if people could watch it again after the race is over no matter what site its on.
I’ve even suggested to them posting it on YouTube so people could rewatch it afterwards . If fans are like me I watch the regular webcast but it would also be cool to rewatch again over and over . I’ll be at Crandon and I totally plan on doing some vids for my YouTube channel . A couple years ago I posted the entire parade and this year I’m gonna try to do it again only this time live on my Instagram
 

Jacob D

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2016
Posts
59
Reaction
47
Location
Abrams
The pro trucks this weekend were very action packed. Pretty chaotic and tight racing which I am always a big fan of. Definitely feel bad for Mittag and Mamer, both breaking down on the last lap with the lead. Hopefully their luck can turn around, as well with Cory Winner
 
Joined
Sep 3, 2020
Posts
11
Reaction
21
Location
Wisconsin
I get that it is what it is and no use beating people up over what happened but... the cancellation of the big trucks on Saturday still makes no sense at all to me. For one, I was always under the impression that unless it was truly pouring and you couldn't see during the race through the sheets of rain, the race would go on. It's off road for crying out loud. I would have always told someone don't let the weather stop you from making a long trek to an off road race, because barring something extraordinary, they will run. I guess I can't say that anymore.

Second, the announcers were acting like this was some kind of extraordinary rain event and seemed to be casting doubt on the idea of getting the track back in shape all along. I'm guessing because that is what they were hearing from race officials. As someone who was there, we had a couple good showers, but it was NOT a storm by any means. I sat out in it the whole time. They were a couple pop up thundershowers (the radar was clear even as they began). A decent soaking, but nothing more. Nothing like what they dealt with on Sunday last year I don't believe, and they raced then.

Third, after the pro lights (which was admittedly a bit of a fiasco to get started, but that's racing) and the mod UTVs, the track was just starting to get in shape. It would only get better, and no rain was coming. So why pull the plug then, after putting all that work into it?

Last, based on some comments I kind of got the impression that the drivers didn't want to run because it would tear up the equipment. Huh? Like what, they would slide into each other and tear up bodies or slide into a rut or tire and flip their truck? The same thing that happens basically EVERY SINGLE RACE, whether it's wet or dry, including the Sunday races? For better or worse, the nature of short course these days is that trucks get demolished each time out, at least superficially. They use body panels like top fuel dragsters use pistons. I just don't understand what those track conditions would have been harder on than any other race. Only thing is maybe clogging the radiators with mud, but again, this is off road- mud is part of the game. Yes there would have been a lot more cleanup on the trucks, but I sure hope that wasn't the justification. They also could have run the pro 4s before the pro 2s and used the class that was less crowded and had vehicles better suited to navigating slick muddy conditions to get the track in even better shape for the big pro 2 class.

All in all it was good racing and probably a successful event, but the way that part of it was handled was completely confusing to myself and anyone I talked to. Especially considering the conditions they have raced through at different events in the past.
 

stephenrjking

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2015
Posts
573
Reaction
940
Location
Duluth, MN
I get that it is what it is and no use beating people up over what happened but... the cancellation of the big trucks on Saturday still makes no sense at all to me. For one, I was always under the impression that unless it was truly pouring and you couldn't see during the race through the sheets of rain, the race would go on. It's off road for crying out loud. I would have always told someone don't let the weather stop you from making a long trek to an off road race, because barring something extraordinary, they will run. I guess I can't say that anymore.

Second, the announcers were acting like this was some kind of extraordinary rain event and seemed to be casting doubt on the idea of getting the track back in shape all along. I'm guessing because that is what they were hearing from race officials. As someone who was there, we had a couple good showers, but it was NOT a storm by any means. I sat out in it the whole time. They were a couple pop up thundershowers (the radar was clear even as they began). A decent soaking, but nothing more. Nothing like what they dealt with on Sunday last year I don't believe, and they raced then.

Third, after the pro lights (which was admittedly a bit of a fiasco to get started, but that's racing) and the mod UTVs, the track was just starting to get in shape. It would only get better, and no rain was coming. So why pull the plug then, after putting all that work into it?

Last, based on some comments I kind of got the impression that the drivers didn't want to run because it would tear up the equipment. Huh? Like what, they would slide into each other and tear up bodies or slide into a rut or tire and flip their truck? The same thing that happens basically EVERY SINGLE RACE, whether it's wet or dry, including the Sunday races? For better or worse, the nature of short course these days is that trucks get demolished each time out, at least superficially. They use body panels like top fuel dragsters use pistons. I just don't understand what those track conditions would have been harder on than any other race. Only thing is maybe clogging the radiators with mud, but again, this is off road- mud is part of the game. Yes there would have been a lot more cleanup on the trucks, but I sure hope that wasn't the justification. They also could have run the pro 4s before the pro 2s and used the class that was less crowded and had vehicles better suited to navigating slick muddy conditions to get the track in even better shape for the big pro 2 class.

All in all it was good racing and probably a successful event, but the way that part of it was handled was completely confusing to myself and anyone I talked to. Especially considering the conditions they have raced through at different events in the past.
As I gather, the drivers voted to postpone. A number of them had already been on the wet track in UTVs.

One might complain that they’re being soft, but:

1. The series that ran really *did* get banged up quite a bit; I would further speculate that the mud might add weight that stresses things like differentials that are expensive, in addition to banging things around.

2. The problem was, to me, at least partly a time issue. Rain earlier in the day has time to get worked out of the track, but what was probably needed was more time to dry and groom, time that wasn’t available due to dwindling daylight.

3. This is key: what’s worse than a series postponing the two most important races on one Saturday? The series running races no matter what, but with only 5 trucks in the field because key drivers don’t think it’s worth the investment to commit to a season because they wind up running in bad conditions and breaking because the series ignored them.

I went to races when Pro 4 was the Greaves show. It was sad. There are serious discussions in the archive of this forum about whether pro 4 could even continue as a division, and in threads from a few years ago the #1 issue with Track Off Road in the Midwest used to be truck counts. There’s a reason I am so enthusiastic about the series right now and it’s not because it ran races in the rain Saturday; it’s because guys like Leduc and Mittag and Beat and Brooks have joined the Kincaids and Kleimans and Greaves to put on a show that is terrific to watch.

And it’s not guaranteed to remain. Pro 4s are expensive and hard to work on. I heard Doug Mittag say that he kinda wishes he was in his Pro 2 out here, but he is committed and charging on; Kyle Leduc isn’t guaranteed to do this forever and has said he’ll only keep at it while the competition is good; RJ Anderson, the world champion, can’t even make it to every weekend. We need these guys.

Yes, it’s disappointing that Off Road can get waylaid by weather. I was disappointed, and would have been significantly more so if I had been there.

But I’d have never gone to Lena last year or Antigo or a second ERX day or be making a semi-permanent transition on Labor Day weekend from watching my long-time favorite sport (college football) to focusing on Crandon if this sport wasn’t drawing Pro drivers and teams from across the country.

So, disappointing, but it comes with the territory.
 

acers

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2017
Posts
287
Reaction
230
Location
green bay, wi.
I get that it is what it is and no use beating people up over what happened but... the cancellation of the big trucks on Saturday still makes no sense at all to me. For one, I was always under the impression that unless it was truly pouring and you couldn't see during the race through the sheets of rain, the race would go on. It's off road for crying out loud. I would have always told someone don't let the weather stop you from making a long trek to an off road race, because barring something extraordinary, they will run. I guess I can't say that anymore.

Second, the announcers were acting like this was some kind of extraordinary rain event and seemed to be casting doubt on the idea of getting the track back in shape all along. I'm guessing because that is what they were hearing from race officials. As someone who was there, we had a couple good showers, but it was NOT a storm by any means. I sat out in it the whole time. They were a couple pop up thundershowers (the radar was clear even as they began). A decent soaking, but nothing more. Nothing like what they dealt with on Sunday last year I don't believe, and they raced then.

Third, after the pro lights (which was admittedly a bit of a fiasco to get started, but that's racing) and the mod UTVs, the track was just starting to get in shape. It would only get better, and no rain was coming. So why pull the plug then, after putting all that work into it?

Last, based on some comments I kind of got the impression that the drivers didn't want to run because it would tear up the equipment. Huh? Like what, they would slide into each other and tear up bodies or slide into a rut or tire and flip their truck? The same thing that happens basically EVERY SINGLE RACE, whether it's wet or dry, including the Sunday races? For better or worse, the nature of short course these days is that trucks get demolished each time out, at least superficially. They use body panels like top fuel dragsters use pistons. I just don't understand what those track conditions would have been harder on than any other race. Only thing is maybe clogging the radiators with mud, but again, this is off road- mud is part of the game. Yes there would have been a lot more cleanup on the trucks, but I sure hope that wasn't the justification. They also could have run the pro 4s before the pro 2s and used the class that was less crowded and had vehicles better suited to navigating slick muddy conditions to get the track in even better shape for the big pro 2 class.

All in all it was good racing and probably a successful event, but the way that part of it was handled was completely confusing to myself and anyone I talked to. Especially considering the conditions they have raced through at different events in the past.
So they should take their trucks that cost 1,2,3 hundred thousand dollars and wreck them on sat. and not be able to race on sun.
 

ltr450rider

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 4, 2013
Posts
359
Reaction
579
Location
California
I think it's the right call to postpone these races when track conditions don't allow for good racing. The muddy/slippery conditions would typically lead to torn up trucks, or a boring race where conditions limit how hard drivers can race each other without wrecking.

A little mud is no big deal for the trucks as long as they aren't overdriven and overheated, but the quality of racing for the fans would suffer.
 

racefan2041

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 6, 2008
Posts
190
Reaction
133
Location
Pulaski WI
Another reason for not running I think is so that the sponsors names on the trucks are visible while people watch the episodes on national tv and at the track. After all they keep the racers and the series funded. Without them we wouldnt have races to watch or talk about.
 

SeanH.

Member
Joined
Jan 5, 2021
Posts
7
Reaction
6
Location
Georgia
Simple reasons on why we voted to cancel the race.
1. That track is so small its a crash fest anyways, now add a slick surface.
2. There's only 5-6 drivers in pro-2 that can drive on a surface that slick and not crash their truck and ruin it for the next race.

They should have never run the pro lites either. Any other track and I don't see it being an issue but Lena has all flat turns and is also very narrow so it would have been a mess.
 

afortune46

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2019
Posts
109
Reaction
199
Location
Iowa
Thanks for posting these. I wasn't able to watch the livestream. A few weeks ago I reached out to COR's marketing person about trying to make the livestreams so they can be replayed after the races. She thought it was a great idea and reached out to that department and they told her that they didn't want to because they want people watching the races on their site. Doesn't make sense because any livestream can be posted on other sites just like I do here in the forum. It would get them more exposure and views if people could watch it again after the race is over no matter what site its on.

not sure if Miranda had mentioned that they do have an on demand or not , typically they have them posted a week after the event - they edit them for TV and post them up to the server after.
 

Curtis Guise

Administrator
Joined
Mar 22, 2001
Posts
13,533
Reaction
4,930
Location
Oceanside, CA
Website
www.offroadaction.com

not sure if Miranda had mentioned that they do have an on demand or not , typically they have them posted a week after the event - they edit them for TV and post them up to the server after.
No she didn't and I wasn't aware of that site. That is basically what I asked for so not sure why they would tell her they didn't want to make replay videos available... I just updated the Crandon thread with the on-demand replays and the video player works. I'll update the rest of the threads. Thanks!
 

afortune46

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2019
Posts
109
Reaction
199
Location
Iowa
No she didn't and I wasn't aware of that site. That is basically what I asked for so not sure why they would tell her they didn't want to make replay videos available... I just updated the Crandon thread with the on-demand replays and the video player works. I'll update the rest of the threads. Thanks!
If you run into anything else like that let me know and I'll do what I can to get you the answers you need.
 

handmethemic

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2006
Posts
644
Reaction
355
Location
Crandon, Wisconsin
Second, the announcers were acting like this was some kind of extraordinary rain event and seemed to be casting doubt on the idea of getting the track back in shape all along. I'm guessing because that is what they were hearing from race officials. As someone who was there, we had a couple good showers, but it was NOT a storm by any means. I sat out in it the whole time. They were a couple pop up thundershowers (the radar was clear even as they began). A decent soaking, but nothing more. Nothing like what they dealt with on Sunday last year I don't believe, and they raced then.
It did rain fairly hard during Pro Light, which is what put the doubt in me that racing would continue. After Pro Mod SxS, it looked like the track would be wet, but pretty darn good for some competitive Pro 2 and Pro 4 racing, so the show went on as usual--we cut to a commercial break with a "Pro 2 is coming up next"...

And then during the break found out that a decision had been made to postpone, and it completely killed the vibe. If you were listening live you certainly heard the disappointment in our voices when we broke the news (the fans in Lena responded in kind with boos and general grumbling).

As always, driver safety is the biggest concern--when it rains as hard as it did (even briefly) it can make it difficult for the safety trucks to get around, and a 10k pound ambulance on non-all-terrain tires would have no chance, if something went badly wrong.

I was pretty disappointed that those two races were postponed, but the weekend turned out just fine either way. 8/10, can't wait to get back next year.
 

acers

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2017
Posts
287
Reaction
230
Location
green bay, wi.
I would like to see COR do some bigger races next year. Antigo and Dirt City are more like sat. night stock car racing. To keep pro4 going strong you need bigger venues for the sponsors . I think COR is doing a fantastic job just think its time to go bigger.
 

stephenrjking

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 28, 2015
Posts
573
Reaction
940
Location
Duluth, MN
I would like to see COR do some bigger races next year. Antigo and Dirt City are more like sat. night stock car racing. To keep pro4 going strong you need bigger venues for the sponsors . I think COR is doing a fantastic job just think its time to go bigger.
What do you have in mind? I think track variety is good. And COR is smartly making good use of its existing fanbase--while there's little geographic diversity, it's not as hard to convince fans already in easy driving distance to plunk down an extra $50 to watch more racing in person.

It seems to me like COR is focusing more on "Where can we hold a successful event" than TORC's "where can we go that sounds impressive" strategy. In the medium term, it probably would be nice to get back to, say, the Chicago area. But first there needs to be a healthy series, and then a plan to promote.

Honestly, I wouldn't focus too much on opening new ground until COR can demonstrate an ability to cultivate the big market it already has a weekend in, Minneapolis-St. Paul. ERX was great this year, with its biggest-ever attendance... but it still didn't clear five figures. Figure out how to reach that metroplex before we worry too much about others.

My opinion only.
 

afortune46

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2019
Posts
109
Reaction
199
Location
Iowa
I would like to see COR do some bigger races next year. Antigo and Dirt City are more like sat. night stock car racing. To keep pro4 going strong you need bigger venues for the sponsors . I think COR is doing a fantastic job just think its time to go bigger.

Right now with Covid - the name of the game is survival , there's a lot of places asking the series to come there , but in the uncertain world we are in right now its not smart business.

Coming from the snocross side of things , they have scouted out some fantastic venues that provided a ton of exposure for all classes - but with the offroad side you have one big hurdle and that's the sportsman. They don't like traveling to ERX let alone something that's more than 4 hours from them. So at that point do it you make it a pro only weekend ? and is it opening the door for a pro only series and just have the sportsman run at select events?

The sportsmen already get upset over perceived the exposure they don't get , the minute you go to pro only events I can imagine the heads exploding because they weren't given the opportunity (yet when the opportunity is there its at lower numbers like you see at ERX). Its really a double edged sword.
 

450grl

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 17, 2006
Posts
2,452
Reaction
661
Location
Chandler, AZ
Website
www.wellerracing.com
What do you have in mind? I think track variety is good. And COR is smartly making good use of its existing fanbase--while there's little geographic diversity, it's not as hard to convince fans already in easy driving distance to plunk down an extra $50 to watch more racing in person.

It seems to me like COR is focusing more on "Where can we hold a successful event" than TORC's "where can we go that sounds impressive" strategy. In the medium term, it probably would be nice to get back to, say, the Chicago area. But first there needs to be a healthy series, and then a plan to promote.

Honestly, I wouldn't focus too much on opening new ground until COR can demonstrate an ability to cultivate the big market it already has a weekend in, Minneapolis-St. Paul. ERX was great this year, with its biggest-ever attendance... but it still didn't clear five figures. Figure out how to reach that metroplex before we worry too much about others.

My opinion only.
WHEATLAND!!!! It would just cap off the mid-west series as having the best tracks in the nation right now, IMO....Wheatland is an AMAZING track and facility!
 

afortune46

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 19, 2019
Posts
109
Reaction
199
Location
Iowa
WHEATLAND!!!! It would just cap off the mid-west series as having the best tracks in the nation right now, IMO....Wheatland is an AMAZING track and facility!
Corry , Is it still owned by lucas and have they rebuilt since the storm hit? Its an awesome venue despite its location. I just haven't heard anything about it.
 
Top