Mint 400 to Fish: Drop Dead?

Dave Cole 4454

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Here is the basic rub, as a promoter you can choose two different models. Monetize and Control everything.

That is definitely SCOREs approach and evidently, based on the post above, the Mints approach.

Or, you can use the adage "rising tide raises all ships". If the industry, fans, and most importantly, the drivers feel good...the gross sum of what you are doing will be better. I might take home a much smaller percentage of the pie...but the pie is way bigger and better.

The thing is Option A is way more profitable. But I personally think it is only profitable in the short term.

For the longest time I was almost ashamed of financial success. The boded well for the event and those associated, because I dumped every cent plus more into making it cool.

At some point we will be profitable, and for the first time, literally in my life, Im not ashamed of it. Because I know that we have done the work.

Sorry for the tangent. None of this is a knock on SCORE or Martellis. More of a nod to my previous post about the slippery slope. I grapple the licensing quandary every year. And as teams become more savvy and successful the boundaries get more and more blurred. I am now seeing the benefits of true trust between the promoter and racer. Perfect example for me is Loren Healy and Vaughn Gitten Jr. They are a true professional organization that uses racing as a marketing tool. They pushed me into alot of uncomfortable situations...but once I fully trusted them and them me (which we as promoters and people tend to forget) we were able to succeed at higher levels individually and as the collective (all racers and fans).

Really sorry for the tangental topic...youre right Jon, the surf is great today ;)
 

fishd00d

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Here is the basic rub, as a promoter you can choose two different models. Monetize and Control everything.

That is definitely SCOREs approach and evidently, based on the post above, the Mints approach.

Or, you can use the adage "rising tide raises all ships". If the industry, fans, and most importantly, the drivers feel good...the gross sum of what you are doing will be better. I might take home a much smaller percentage of the pie...but the pie is way bigger and better.

The thing is Option A is way more profitable. But I personally think it is only profitable in the short term.

For the longest time I was almost ashamed of financial success. The boded well for the event and those associated, because I dumped every cent plus more into making it cool.

At some point we will be profitable, and for the first time, literally in my life, Im not ashamed of it. Because I know that we have done the work.

Sorry for the tangent. None of this is a knock on SCORE or Martellis. More of a nod to my previous post about the slippery slope. I grapple the licensing quandary every year. And as teams become more savvy and successful the boundaries get more and more blurred. I am now seeing the benefits of true trust between the promoter and racer. Perfect example for me is Loren Healy and Vaughn Gitten Jr. They are a true professional organization that uses racing as a marketing tool. They pushed me into alot of uncomfortable situations...but once I fully trusted them and them me (which we as promoters and people tend to forget) we were able to succeed at higher levels individually and as the collective (all racers and fans).

Really sorry for the tangental topic...youre right Jon, the surf is great today ;)
You’re spot on and this is exactly why MOST people love you and your series 😂😂
 

MTPyle

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I reached out to Matt. I figured I would get the info straight from him before I react. The only reason my sponsor wants me to race the Mint is for exposure. They pay our entrance fee for that reason. If our entrance fee does not give us the right to promote and in fact hinders us then thats messed up.

Will be interesting if Matt responds at all. My perception of him is he may ignore me or respond while thumbing his chest. Not saying thats a fair perception but it is what it is. I am open to admitting I was wrong, I do that a lot. LOL

Dave you get it, Can you please just figure out how to buy the Mint? Haha I know you don't have enough going on and just watching soaps while eating Bon Bon's

Mike
 

E.Hagle

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Here is the basic rub, as a promoter you can choose two different models. Monetize and Control everything.

That is definitely SCOREs approach and evidently, based on the post above, the Mints approach.

Or, you can use the adage "rising tide raises all ships". If the industry, fans, and most importantly, the drivers feel good...the gross sum of what you are doing will be better. I might take home a much smaller percentage of the pie...but the pie is way bigger and better.

The thing is Option A is way more profitable. But I personally think it is only profitable in the short term.

For the longest time I was almost ashamed of financial success. The boded well for the event and those associated, because I dumped every cent plus more into making it cool.

At some point we will be profitable, and for the first time, literally in my life, Im not ashamed of it. Because I know that we have done the work.

Sorry for the tangent. None of this is a knock on SCORE or Martellis. More of a nod to my previous post about the slippery slope. I grapple the licensing quandary every year. And as teams become more savvy and successful the boundaries get more and more blurred. I am now seeing the benefits of true trust between the promoter and racer. Perfect example for me is Loren Healy and Vaughn Gitten Jr. They are a true professional organization that uses racing as a marketing tool. They pushed me into alot of uncomfortable situations...but once I fully trusted them and them me (which we as promoters and people tend to forget) we were able to succeed at higher levels individually and as the collective (all racers and fans).

Really sorry for the tangental topic...youre right Jon, the surf is great today ;)
How does one retain more capital by restrictions placed on everyone else? Exclusive content only found in one place draws in larger dollars from existing sponsors?
 

fishd00d

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How does one retain more capital by restrictions placed on everyone else? Exclusive content only found in one place draws in larger dollars from existing sponsors?
That’s simple. If one spot has everything then everyone is forced to goto that one spot. If you have 10 spots to go the overall number will be higher of views but it will be diluted between 10 spots.
 

fatsaz

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This about money and greed. That's it. Fish great job and keep it going. Fish how about those 6200 cars? TTspec killers. Lol
 

EasyE

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I reached out to Matt. I figured I would get the info straight from him before I react. The only reason my sponsor wants me to race the Mint is for exposure. They pay our entrance fee for that reason. If our entrance fee does not give us the right to promote and in fact hinders us then thats messed up.
It does give you the right to promote, you the TEAM. Anything else needs to be cleared in advance and may be free or if you're Fish not free and probably 3x LOL. I've had conversations with MM about media and promoting non-endemic clients I work with through projects at Mint and he's always had "rising tide raises all ships" attitude. Using old adages, maybe there comes a point where "why buy the cow when i get milk for free" gets old for them and, like Dave, feel they've done the work and want to be paid?
 

critter81

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That’s simple. If one spot has everything then everyone is forced to goto that one spot. If you have 10 spots to go the overall number will be higher of views but it will be diluted between 10 spots.
Fish a couple of things.. First I think what you do is REALLY GOOD!! like really good and you should contact me I might toss some cash your way for some commercial spots.. However if (BIG IF ) there is TV coverage of an event then I can understand why the promoter would control access. This access control is very common I have dealt with it for over 20 years with AMA Superbike, Dorna, IOMTT, Dakar, Speed TV, Discovery Networks, MAV TV and several others. When you add TV to the mix things become complicated very fast. Now that being said if the Mint has no TV coverage planned than not having Fish is just plan F-in stoopid.. So my question is does the Mint have a TV deal?
 

MTPyle

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It does give you the right to promote, you the TEAM. Anything else needs to be cleared in advance and may be free or if you're Fish not free and probably 3x LOL. I've had conversations with MM about media and promoting non-endemic clients I work with through projects at Mint and he's always had "rising tide raises all ships" attitude. Using old adages, maybe there comes a point where "why buy the cow when i get milk for free" gets old for them and, like Dave, feel they've done the work and want to be paid?

But are my sponsors considered part of our "team"? or are they seen as commercial and need a commercial license?

It's not like we make money in this sport. My gosh. They should at least let us get all we can for sponsors that support us.

But what if I have a competing Sponsor that is sa direct competitor that is also sponsoring the event? Like another tire brand, or maybe another energy drink?

Mike
 

fishd00d

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But are my sponsors considered part of our "team"? or are they seen as commercial and need a commercial license?

It's not like we make money in this sport. My gosh. They should at least let us get all we can for sponsors that support us.

But what if I have a competing Sponsor that is sa direct competitor that is also sponsoring the event? Like another tire brand, or maybe another energy drink?

Mike
Let us know what you find out. However I have been in touch with a few race teams and sponsors who tried to post about their sponsored driver from the UTVWC and they were sent a bill notice after doing so. It’s funny because according to IG/FB policy you can repost without it being “illegal”. Which is why they specifically put that wordage in their terms.

Also there has not been a live TV package for any race I am aware of in a very long time. That’s the only way I would see someone not wanting much else but at the same time unless they are streaming from the course live you really are not competing.

It simply can all be traced back to $$.
 

Jerry Zaiden

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Here is the basic rub, as a promoter you can choose two different models. Monetize and Control everything.

That is definitely SCOREs approach and evidently, based on the post above, the Mints approach.

Or, you can use the adage "rising tide raises all ships". If the industry, fans, and most importantly, the drivers feel good...the gross sum of what you are doing will be better. I might take home a much smaller percentage of the pie...but the pie is way bigger and better.

The thing is Option A is way more profitable. But I personally think it is only profitable in the short term.

For the longest time I was almost ashamed of financial success. The boded well for the event and those associated, because I dumped every cent plus more into making it cool.

At some point we will be profitable, and for the first time, literally in my life, Im not ashamed of it. Because I know that we have done the work.

Sorry for the tangent. None of this is a knock on SCORE or Martellis. More of a nod to my previous post about the slippery slope. I grapple the licensing quandary every year. And as teams become more savvy and successful the boundaries get more and more blurred. I am now seeing the benefits of true trust between the promoter and racer. Perfect example for me is Loren Healy and Vaughn Gitten Jr. They are a true professional organization that uses racing as a marketing tool. They pushed me into alot of uncomfortable situations...but once I fully trusted them and them me (which we as promoters and people tend to forget) we were able to succeed at higher levels individually and as the collective (all racers and fans).

Really sorry for the tangental topic...youre right Jon, the surf is great today ;)

Dave you are 110% spot on and I share your same feelings. What people want is to be excited. We have tried to race in SCORE and some of our sponsors don't want to be part of it because of invoices they have received or of hearing about companies receiving after they had posted a picture and/or used trademark names. We ran the Toyota / Leno program at the MINT because the Martellies welcomed the exposure. The others wanted to charge a lot of money. I do get it and understand why they do it, it's their business and they can do as they wish. I just see things differently and so do some of the companies that support us.

What you are doing is absolutely amazing and it shows every year. It's kind of like an Off-Road festive where racers, families, fans, etc can go camp, spectate or at night be part of the culture and entertainment. This is what makes the event so good for more than a week.
 

EasyE

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But are my sponsors considered part of our "team"? or are they seen as commercial and need a commercial license?

It's not like we make money in this sport. My gosh. They should at least let us get all we can for sponsors that support us.

But what if I have a competing Sponsor that is sa direct competitor that is also sponsoring the event? Like another tire brand, or maybe another energy drink?

Mike
Sponsor isn't your team, (no pass through rights) and Whipple is paying for YOU to promote, expecting Mint, Fishgistics, TrophyBurro, etc to do it for you as part of YOUR deal is a stretch, UNLESS you go do something cool, like win or crash big LOL
Competing brands is never an issue, look at FELD and SX. They don't cut away from Webb b/c it's a Monster event. You win you get coverage.
 

havahockey

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But are my sponsors considered part of our "team"? or are they seen as commercial and need a commercial license?

It's not like we make money in this sport. My gosh. They should at least let us get all we can for sponsors that support us.

But what if I have a competing Sponsor that is sa direct competitor that is also sponsoring the event? Like another tire brand, or maybe another energy drink?

Mike

If you post on your own social media, put our a pr, post on your website, etc, its considered team use and there aren't fees. When business/sponsors want to share any content whether its content they paid for or are resharing, they will need to have a commercial license from The Mint to do so. If they don't get one prior they will be sent an invoice for the licensing fee plus an invoice for the usage is what my understanding is from reading the media license.
 

Argentino

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IIRC, That permit was only for 5 years and the city was trying to take the land. Ask some of the people on the OHV committee and see where it stands. Last I knew, when that permit was up, it wouldn't be restored and the Mint was going to have to move.

That was 3 years ago, which leaves this year and the next.
 
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