Mint 400 & UTVWC Independent in 2020

J Prich

Well-Known Member
It's unfair to compare what Dave can do with KOH (in an open OHV area) and what the Mint can do as far as spectating. I do agree that Dave has a much better overall event and believe a big part of that equation is the fact that you can camp at the event and move around to different areas to watch the race, while also being able to visit Hammertown and wander around all the sponsor tents. The Mint is a different beast, I enjoy the Las Vegas portion of the event and believe Vegas is the proper place to hold all the pre-race events, but I've never thought about driving down to pack myself into a spectator area and be trapped there for the day. I stay in Vegas (or drive home) and watch the race online. This is exactly what the Martelli's need to focus and I think are focusing on, the media site of the race. The lack of mobility and the closed course restrictions have forced them to put on a media event. Entirely different than KOH. KOH does have awesome on-line content the entire week of KOH.
Pretty fair in my personal opinion. I think sometimes the complaints that people have about things that aren't happening or haven't happened aren't always rooted in a rational consideration of why it might not be happening. Most folks would obviously prefer not to be corralled in to spectating pens, but given the actual circumstances...I'd argue the current set up is better than nothing. In fact, when other orgs, even BITD, have run other races in this exact area, most of the current Mint spectator areas are not even open for spectators at all. Until the Mint, NO ONE was spectating any races on transmission alley/test section. So some of it just comes down to being half full vs. half empty.

I think most of this comes down to how people perceive things...if they have a favorable view of a person or thing, they are more inclined to see things in a positive light. If they have a negative view, they are more inclined to see things through that lens. In my opinion there is what I am now coining as a "Martelli effect" (TM) in which some people who have a negative view of Mad Media for whatever reason, stop taking the time to really analyze what they're mad about and just assume the worst. It's a bit of a confirmation bias I think.
 
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J Prich

Well-Known Member
First question should really be two parts, will motos race again, and will quads ever get to race? We didn't get to play this year.

Doug
The funny thing about your comment to me is here in a conversation full of a handful of people complaining about how the Mint isn't their thing, is a guy asking why he didn't get to participate. For every person here complaining about how they don't care about the Mint and don't want to participate for whatever reason, there is someone who's unhappy because they didn't get the opportunity to participate at all.
 

cynicwanderer

Well-Known Member
First question should really be two parts, will motos race again, and will quads ever get to race? We didn't get to play this year.

Doug
yeah, that was stupid/weird... quads could have made the technical stuff easier than the harley's... at least that's what I heard the reason was for not running the quads; all the technical "single track".
 

tapped1069

George of the Jungle
So who's organization are they going to use to pull the permits? AND...……. now that BITD has a couple open slots on their calendar, maybe they can bring back the REAL Laughlin GP!
 

BITD_1021

Well-Known Member
So was it BITD that charged all the extra fees or the Mint 400? If the racers were charged extra by the MINT 400 and not BITD, then I'm thinking it was profit for the Martellis.
Popcorn...
Can't wait for this one to get an answer.
tenor.gif
 

Goober

Well-Known Member
Can't we just combine it into one series? Parker, San Felipe, Mint, Baja 500, KOH-Fireworks 250 style, V2R-night race, and the 1000.
 

M.Tornel Jr

Well-Known Member
I think it sucks i doubt bitd isnt going to add another race to make up. The schedule is going to end up being really tight. It was going so perfectly, why change something if its not broken. Anyway hope the best for both organizations.
 

BITD_1021

Well-Known Member
I think it sucks i doubt bitd isnt going to add another race to make up. The schedule is going to end up being really tight. It was going so perfectly, why change something if its not broken. Anyway hope the best for both organizations.
Because the risk is bigger than the reward for BITD.
 

BITD_1021

Well-Known Member
Just going to say again - From day 1, we (The Mint 400) have never been in control of payouts. ...At our own event.... ...Have never been in control of payouts...
Typical 400 mile race for BITD entry fee is $2300
Mint 400 entry $3250
BITD isn't paying out any additional money from their typical payouts. Wheres the $950 going in additional entry fee? Day 1 quote ... makes sense why BITD can't pay more since they get the same money they always get for payouts. Kind of looks like you're blaming BITD for the low payout when racers pay an additional $950 to race Mint. Where's the money ($950 x 350+ entries... maybe only 250+ racers pay the additional $950)? I must be missing something. Any help on race fees for utv classes, motorcycle classes???
 
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MTPyle

Well-Known Member
The great thing is both groups get to prove what they can do on their own.

Personally I was not impressed during the Martelli interview they acted like tracking was a BITD issue. They said at least twice that they want control everything and they will have tracking that works. Implying that BITD was to blame for the horrible tracking at the Mint. We all know BITD uses Racetrax. I would have a lot more respect for them if they said they screwed up and they picked the wrong tracking company with YB.

They had no problem admitting the Sunday afternoon racing didn’t work. So I know they have it in them to admit they are wrong. Now they need to do it with tracking. In my opinion the tracking was the biggest single fail of the 2019 Mint 400.

Mike
 
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ndvalium

Rescue Director
yeah, that was stupid/weird... quads could have made the technical stuff easier than the harley's... at least that's what I heard the reason was for not running the quads; all the technical "single track".
It wasnt simply a case of the wide path of a single quad. BLM designates and approves certain courses based on certain specs. Having a quad on a course that in most cases was wide enough for a single quad isnt the issue. The issue is now when you have a quad passing a quad. a "single" track approved course now gets 8-10 feet wide in a hurry. I am sure most have no idea what went into the Motorcycles return to the Mint. I will tell you with the Governemnt shut down in the middle of the permit process for the Bikes, the course changed several times and to be honest was days from getting cancelled in Early February. That race almost didnt happen and it took everyone working their ass off for the bikes to get in there.


They had a bike with a side car on it. So how wide was that?
That vehicle was for show and was not permitted to leave the Primm portion of the course. He crossed the bridge and came back. The course was not approved by BLM for him to be on.
 

cynicwanderer

Well-Known Member
It wasnt simply a case of the wide path of a single quad. BLM designates and approves certain courses based on certain specs. Having a quad on a course that in most cases was wide enough for a single quad isnt the issue. The issue is now when you have a quad passing a quad. a "single" track approved course now gets 8-10 feet wide in a hurry. I am sure most have no idea what went into the Motorcycles return to the Mint. I will tell you with the Governemnt shut down in the middle of the permit process for the Bikes, the course changed several times and to be honest was days from getting cancelled in Early February. That race almost didnt happen and it took everyone working their ass off for the bikes to get in there.


That vehicle was for show and was not permitted to leave the Primm portion of the course. He crossed the bridge and came back. The course was not approved by BLM for him to be on.
OK, thanks for clarifying. I just wish some of this stuff would have been more transparent from the beginning, rather than us wondering what was going on and speculating.
 

tapped1069

George of the Jungle
OK, thanks for clarifying. I just wish some of this stuff would have been more transparent from the beginning, rather than us wondering what was going on and speculating.
HAHAHAHAHA!!!! Can you imagine the crying and "what ifs" and the "What do we do nows",, if they would have let that outta the bag?? "THE SKY IS FALLING"!!!!!
 

J Prich

Well-Known Member
OK, thanks for clarifying. I just wish some of this stuff would have been more transparent from the beginning, rather than us wondering what was going on and speculating.
Works both ways. No one anywhere is trying to spend their time sharing the thought process behind their business decisions, working processes, etc. As noted, the more "transparent" you are, the more people will find things to complain about in that too so that's a lose-lose prospect. Another way to do this is to speculate less about things we don't know and stop making assumptions.

"Just cause you don't know what's going on don't mean it don't make no sense,
and just cause you don't like it don't mean it ain't no good..."
 

cynicwanderer

Well-Known Member
Works both ways. No one anywhere is trying to spend their time sharing the thought process behind their business decisions, working processes, etc. As noted, the more "transparent" you are, the more people will find things to complain about in that too so that's a lose-lose prospect. Another way to do this is to speculate less about things we don't know and stop making assumptions.

"Just cause you don't know what's going on don't mean it don't make no sense,
and just cause you don't like it don't mean it ain't no good..."
well, sure, but I still have the right to voice my opinion. I.e. while I now understand the reason behind the decision, I still think it was stupid that they didn't include quads in the Mint400, which was, after all, a BITD series race.
 

J Prich

Well-Known Member
well, sure, but I still have the right to voice my opinion. I.e. while I now understand the reason behind the decision, I still think it was stupid that they didn't include quads in the Mint400, which was, after all, a BITD series race.
Go nuts, voice your opinion. But maybe take some ownership and responsibility for the assumptions you make instead of putting all the blame on the other side for not telling you what you think you should know. Maybe you bear some of the responsibility for making false assumptions about things you don't know anything about.
 

cynicwanderer

Well-Known Member
Go nuts, voice your opinion. But maybe take some ownership and responsibility for the assumptions you make instead of putting all the blame on the other side for not telling you what you think you should know. Maybe you bear some of the responsibility for making false assumptions about things you don't know anything about.
like I said in the original post, [... at least that's what I heard the reason was for not running the quads; all the technical "single track"], it wasn't my assumption to start with. also, it wasn't really all that wrong anyway. I.e. BLM didn't want the single tracks blown out by passing quads.
 
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