• Forum membership has its advantages....

Norra Legend Trucks, bypass shocks

Rory

Crayola Killer
Crafty, you have 8 months to get it ready for next years Mexican 1000. If it were my truck I would restore it to it’s original glory. The routes Norra uses bypass shocks aren’t going to be a big advantage. I know of a few other trucks that are being built for the Legends Era Truck Class and I look forward to competing with them.


Sent from my iPhone using race-deZert mobile app
I agree with Mark. Bypass shocks for a truck with less than 12-15" of travel is not really an advantage. The best thing to do is go testing and make sure your shocks are valved correctly. Updating to 2.5 smooth bodied shocks is a good plan unless you really want to show everybody that a set of Rough Country or Bilstien shocks can still win out in Baja.....as proven by Mark Stahl the last couple years. Hell, Mark has even been beating up on buggies that are suppose to be faster than him (wink wink Bob). :D
 

bajatime

Member
I agree with Mark. Bypass shocks for a truck with less than 12-15" of travel is not really an advantage. The best thing to do is go testing and make sure your shocks are valved correctly. Updating to 2.5 smooth bodied shocks is a good plan unless you really want to show everybody that a set of Rough Country or Bilstien shocks can still win out in Baja.....as proven by Mark Stahl the last couple years. Hell, Mark has even been beating up on buggies that are suppose to be faster than him (wink wink Bob). :D
We'll see when we have all four cylinders.
 

LantanaTX

Well-Known Member
We'll see when we have all four cylinders.
Rory is a is a funny and fairly intelligent guy but he is wrong on the shocks. Legend is 2” shocks and reservoirs are Ok. This truck appear to be a Legend Era Truck once the front shocks get changed. If you get the shocks tuned, the bypass shocks won’t matter much on a NORRA course. We hope to be racing with this truck in the Legend Era!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

crafty

Well-Known Member
Yes at one point it was legend era then challenger era. It now sits at it last progression before retired. Looks to me it would fit vintage open with rear leafs. I’m not looking for advantages just wanting to keep it original to its last build. To me it would be wrong to take e perfect legend truck cut the engine cage out redesign it and put bypasses on it. Guess I’m lucky to have a truck that progressed enough that I have options
 

LantanaTX

Well-Known Member
Yes at one point it was legend era then challenger era. It now sits at it last progression before retired. Looks to me it would fit vintage open with rear leafs. I’m not looking for advantages just wanting to keep it original to its last build. To me it would be wrong to take e perfect legend truck cut the engine cage out redesign it and put bypasses on it. Guess I’m lucky to have a truck that progressed enough that I have options
I don't think anyone would think you are trying to get an advantage racing in Vintage Era. The trucks in Open Vintage with Leaf's have bypass shocks on the rear too. The big prize at NORRA is the ERA Overall's which I don't believe your truck can compete for in the Vintage Era Last year the Vintage Era Overall Went to the Bob Gordon Chenowth buggy which also finished 2nd overall overall behind Mark Post and the Riviera Trophy Truck. There is some super fast stuff in Vintage Era and it keeps getting faster because 20 years old now takes us to 1999 for the next NORRA which probably puts the Riviera TT in your era for 2019. The Legend Era Overall which is the Frank "Scoop" Vessel's Memorial Trophy has gone to a Legend Truck every year since the inception of the Era Overall format. What ever you decide to do cool and we are all happy to have another cool truck at NORRA!
 

Rory

Crayola Killer
Rory is a is a funny and fairly intelligent guy but he is wrong on the shocks. Legend is 2” shocks and reservoirs are Ok. This truck appear to be a Legend Era Truck once the front shocks get changed. If you get the shocks tuned, the bypass shocks won’t matter much on a NORRA course. We hope to be racing with this truck in the Legend Era!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
I'm Not as intelligent as Bob, he’s been racing in the desert for a whole 5 years now and knows a lot more about vintage racing than I do. That being said I was making reference to the fact his truck now has by pass shocks and if he switched to just regular smooth bodied shocks his truck would work just fine. As an example I used Mark Stahl’s truck whom is only using 2” shocks and is cleaning up in the Legend class and has consistently beat up on The supposedly faster Buggies in the same Era (proven by his 3 Overall Era trophie
 

LantanaTX

Well-Known Member
I'm Not as intelligent as Bob, he’s been racing in the desert for a whole 5 years now and knows a lot more about vintage racing than I do. That being said I was making reference to the fact his truck now has by pass shocks and if he switched to just regular smooth bodied shocks his truck would work just fine. As an example I used Mark Stahl’s truck whom is only using 2” shocks and is cleaning up in the Legend class and has consistently beat up on The supposedly faster Buggies in the same Era (proven by his 3 Overall Era trophie
Easy Rory, I was only making the correction of 2.0 vs 2.5 but I may have to correct you again. I missed the first year of vintage racing in 2010 because I used up vacation time crewing with Dave Tilton on the Jacinto Class 1 car in BITD. I have been at NORRA since the second race in 2011 working my way from crew to co-driver to car owner/driver. I know the rules because you and I both helped write the new rules in 2015 and I wrote the rules for SCORE. I know you love old race cars like many of us. Too many great cars were updated over the years or cut up. It would be great to see more race cars in the early Era's. Before the rules were redone in 2015 Mark Stahl raced in a big class, now most of his competitors have been booted Vintage Open with Leafs. While we have won the Legend Buggy class, the Legend overall has been tough. If we ever win the overall, after Dave Tilton and team, the first person I will thank is Mark Stahl. He has a become a good friend and nobody has improved our program more than Mark Stahl becuase of the level of competition and consistency that he brings to NORRA every year. If you really want to improve, race against a multi time Baja 1000 champion!
 

Rory

Crayola Killer
I wish RDC wasn't having issues posting because it cut off half of my post which was pretty Funny......Mostly at your expense Bob Hehehehe. Just poking back Bob, was typing with a smile on my face the entire time, I guess I know what to get you for Christmas in the skin department :D (note smiley face). No correction needed Bob, I know how long you've been in the sport and we are glad to have you. As for Mark, don't worry< I had a talk with him and he said he would try and slow down a little more this year to make it interesting :D (Note another smiley face).

Back to the thread, do whatever you'd like with the truck, just remember when you start cutting things off the more chance the truck will never make it back to the way it was. You'd be surprised what that truck would do with 2" shocks (or technically 2.2 or 2.3") in the VINTAGE class....

s-l1000.jpg


Or if you wanted to jump up a class to the Challenger era change them all to 2.5 smooth bodied...

oem-performance-front-piggyback-shocks-without-adjuster.jpg


I question you need to ask yourself is "What do i plan on doing with this truck"? Race, chase, prerun? If racing, what series? What class? Vintage or sportsman? The Vintage rules are moving away from "Run what ya brung" so find an era and build to that era. If sportsman or 1450, do whatever you'd like. Good luck with your decision.
 

crafty

Well-Known Member
I’m waiting on photos from last owner. I’m hoping he has some of pre bypass shocks. Will the shock towers through the hood still be legal if I change to 2 or 2.5?
 

LantanaTX

Well-Known Member
I’m waiting on photos from last owner. I’m hoping he has some of pre bypass shocks. Will the shock towers through the hood still be legal if I change to 2 or 2.5?
There no rule against that.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

crafty

Well-Known Member
I’m located in Nor Cal. I want to be able to take anywhere to race. I’m not sure how rules differ from each race organization.
 

Rory

Crayola Killer
I’m located in Nor Cal. I want to be able to take anywhere to race. I’m not sure how rules differ from each race organization.
The end game is to have the rules the same for every series, only makes sense. Baby steps as of right now.
 

Mark Stahl

Well-Known Member
Easy Rory, I was only making the correction of 2.0 vs 2.5 but I may have to correct you again. I missed the first year of vintage racing in 2010 because I used up vacation time crewing with Dave Tilton on the Jacinto Class 1 car in BITD. I have been at NORRA since the second race in 2011 working my way from crew to co-driver to car owner/driver. I know the rules because you and I both helped write the new rules in 2015 and I wrote the rules for SCORE. I know you love old race cars like many of us. Too many great cars were updated over the years or cut up. It would be great to see more race cars in the early Era's. Before the rules were redone in 2015 Mark Stahl raced in a big class, now most of his competitors have been booted Vintage Open with Leafs. While we have won the Legend Buggy class, the Legend overall has been tough. If we ever win the overall, after Dave Tilton and team, the first person I will thank is Mark Stahl. He has a become a good friend and nobody has improved our program more than Mark Stahl becuase of the level of competition and consistency that he brings to NORRA every year. If you really want to improve, race against a multi time Baja 1000 champion!
Boy Bob, I guess you and Rory are having a good time back and forth at each other. And thank you for the compliments. We Definitely had to press hard this year to win the Legends Era Trophy this year.

Sent from my iPhone using race-deZert mobile app
 

Mark Stahl

Well-Known Member
I’m waiting on photos from last owner. I’m hoping he has some of pre bypass shocks. Will the shock towers through the hood still be legal if I change to 2 or 2.5?
Crafty, I can’t see why you would need to change the shock mounts. Get the same length 2 inch smooth body shocks.


Sent from my iPhone using race-deZert mobile app
 

partybarge_pilot

Well-Known Member
Crafty, I can’t see why you would need to change the shock mounts. Get the same length 2 inch smooth body shocks.
He needs more than one shock in there Mark. It will need new mounts if he's going to run multiple shocks. The trick set up would be to make the mounts bolt on. That way he could switch back to his current 3.0 bypass.
 

LantanaTX

Well-Known Member
I’m located in Nor Cal. I want to be able to take anywhere to race. I’m not sure how rules differ from each race organization.
BITD and SCORE only have two vintage classes to accommodate a small number of entries. NORRA is based on era’s with lots of classes in each era. Just like back in the day, you can win your class as well as the overall. NORRA can do this as they are approaching 300 entries.

The only thing that is consistent across all three organizations is that BITD and SCORE both have an ‘82 and older class which has the same rules as NORRA’s Legend Era except BITD does allow bypass shocks in ‘82 and older trucks if it is the only shock on each corner. There is nothing vintage about this and is not legal in in SCORE and NORRA’s ‘82 and older classes. So 2” shocks will make you legal anywhere and you would be very competitive.

BITD and SCORE’s second class is more of a “catch all” post ‘82 class. I don’t see the rules ever being the same across all organizations although when I did the SCORE rules I based them on NORRA’s ‘82 and older era’s and the second class was based on NORRA’s Challenger Era. I then had to open up the newer class to allow BITD racers to race SCORE. SCORE only put one demand on me which was anyone legal in NORRA or BITD can race SCORE.

SCORE entries are dwindling with only one finisher after the first 3 races. Modern SCORE courses are brutal and vintage may or may not survive there.

NORRA started vintage racing and pretty much owns the brand now. Your best bet is pick your NORRA class. If you are legal in a NORRA class I am sure the other organizations will let you race as they need every entry they can get.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

crafty

Well-Known Member
Thank you for all the amazing info. I’m leaning towards challenger era for now due to fact that I have 2.5 in rear already. I’m on a limited budget can’t do all 2.0 any time soon. Paint will stay as is. Needs new fuel bladder, tires, rebuild rear shocks, change fluids and window nets. I imagine I’ll have to upgrade seats and belts due to age not condition.
 

LantanaTX

Well-Known Member
Thank you for all the amazing info. I’m leaning towards challenger era for now due to fact that I have 2.5 in rear already. I’m on a limited budget can’t do all 2.0 any time soon. Paint will stay as is. Needs new fuel bladder, tires, rebuild rear shocks, change fluids and window nets. I imagine I’ll have to upgrade seats and belts due to age not condition.
Challenger is a great class as well! There a ton of Vintage Open classes but many them are there so that everyone has a place to race that aren’t vintage correct. Maybe someday some of those classes can be reduced by forming a Sportsman class. Then there would be an incentive restore to period correct.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Top