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Northern Arizona Race for Trucks and Buggies

Kyle Krause

Well-Known Member
#1
Are there any Truck and Buggy racers that would race at the Cinders in Flagstaff Arizona?

I wanted to get a vote on who would race the Cinders this year July 28-29 if we added you guys to the program? Please tag anyone who races a truck or buggy... We are planning on doing a long course 20 plus miles loop...
 

scottm

Well-Known Member
#4
What are you lolling about? Kyle is the only org putting on and even trying to put on races in AZ.

Kyle where would the course be? Cinder lake/power line side?
 

ndvalium

Rescue Director
#5
What are you lolling about? Kyle is the only org putting on and even trying to put on races in AZ.

Kyle where would the course be? Cinder lake/power line side?
I will speculate one of two things people are "lol" about -

1: The statement of 20 miles being a long course race.

2: the sheer challenge for teams to throw a new race in their schedule in essentially very short notice.


In my experience, most teams lay out their race plan in the fall of the previous years. If they want to run for points, then they may lay out two race plans based on finish results of first events they race in. After that, their race choices are fairly laid out as is their prep and even their vacation times from life.

On the opposite side of the coin, I attended my first race as a spectator in over a decade. It was AZOP Western Raceway event and was impressed with Kyle and his support team as I watched a decent turnout of Bikes, Quads and UTV's race a small facility and put on some great racing all weekend long.
 

fatsaz

Well-Known Member
#6
I find it funny people dislike a comment When there car sits around and does not race. Even when there r race organizations like azop and Sadr. But for me 5 or 6 20 miles loops is not a desert race. Sorry but that's just my 2 cents. No disrespect to azop but not for me.
 

soaz1699

Active Member
#9
I would love to race in Arizona I realize that means A short 20-30 mile loop but to race on a Sunday after noon and start the race 2 hours after the posted time no thanks.
 
#10
It's more if a short course race than a desert race you should Google desert racing and see what a real desert race looks like before advertising desert racing. Qualifying, 100 mile laps, tech these are just a few things that go along with real desert racing. We can help you out with some races to come watch if you would like to get a idea of what it would be like.
 

TJ_Gambino

Well-Known Member
#11
You know what they say about OPINIONS . . . With that said, Kyle does a great job putting on races for Bikes, Quads and UTV's. Nice places to race and the courses are challenging. HOWEVER, the truck and buggy races are more of an AFTER THOUGHT in my opinion. Races are run on Sunday and on the same course as the Bike, QUADS and UTV's. And as soaz1699 stated - they usually start late.

Kyle does not do this for his enjoyment. He needs to make money. This is a business first. Bikes, Quads and UTV's make up 90% of his entries. So he caters to these racers.

Truck and buggy guys have to decide; do I want to run a tight, short race that is close to home OR run a long desert race that might take more time, effort and logistics to attend.

ALSO: throwing out a request for truck and buggy racers to attend the Flagstaff race at this time just proves that it is more of an "after thought" vs. a "commitment".
 

scottm

Well-Known Member
#12
Well he also takes what he can get. The big Gila Bend course was lost when Clinton made the area a national monument on his last day in office. The vulture mine race was lost for 10 years after someone ran over a saguaro, then were busted trying to load it in a pickup. The best az race other than the Parker 425 was the Snowflake race, but a new crew took over the forest service right after the California 200 disaster, and they decided the race was going away, even though it had run for 30 years with no problem. Kyle is slowly gaining the trust of BLM and forest service with successful and safe events. Two years ago they would not allow a race on the east side of the cinder mtn rec area, which includes the cinder lake and power line roads that Whiplash used to run for 20 years. Maybe now they are considering allowing it. This is a baby step towards better racing, and no one is in a better position to get it back than Kyle and AZOP. Im grateful for his effort and hoping it will come back.
 

fatsaz

Well-Known Member
#13
If you think a 50 plus mile lap race in az will happen your crazy. Those days r gone. Sad to say. Baby steps r not going help. If u like short races then azop is for u. But I'm not going to pay the same entry fee to run 100 miles when I can run 250,300,200 and 150. Also with no grand prix finish. That's a joke.
 

TJ_Gambino

Well-Known Member
#14
I applaud the efforts Kyle has made, however baby steps are exactly that, SMALL. The accident in Ca. gave the AZ BLM just the ammo needed to do what they have ALWAYS wanted to do. All off road races where effected by that accident and it will continue to impact the future of the sport. Future legislation on the Vulture Mine area may take that race away AGAIN despite Kyles best efforts.

I look at AZOP for what it is - race promotions for Bikes, Quads and UTV's. For people who race those types of machines, I say continue to support Kyle and AZOP. However, truck and buggys WILL NEVER see racing like ADRA and Whiplash put on. The BLM and state agencies don't want it and unfortunately won't let it.
 

scottm

Well-Known Member
#15
There was never a small time 50 mile lap race in az, and I did not say that was the requirement for 'better' racing to happen.
 

Speedster

Well-Known Member
#17
Kyle, thank you for all that you are doing to promote desert racing in AZ, and for all the effort and red-tape cutting it takes to hold these races. Also, thank you for doing your best to have trucks & buggies at these races and for coming to RDC to invite us.
My apologies that there are so many ungrateful critics on here, that find it so easy to complain yet rarely have solutions and even more rarely do anything positive to promote our sport other than pay their entry fees.

The Cinder Mountain 100 was my first race ever, on a bone-stock Honda 250R back in 1992 with ADRA. I later raced it with Whiplash. I am glad to see you continuing to hold races there, and in my opinion you are doing every bit as good of a job as ADRA and Whiplash did.
 

scottm

Well-Known Member
#18
It's more if a short course race than a desert race you should Google desert racing and see what a real desert race looks like before advertising desert racing. Qualifying, 100 mile laps, tech these are just a few things that go along with real desert racing. We can help you out with some races to come watch if you would like to get a idea of what it would be like.
WTF? Maybe assume the people you are talking to have heard of desert racing before making your first post.
 
#20
I agree with Gambino Kyle caters towards Bikes and Quads he should that is where the money is. I would gladly bring my 1600 cars and race Cinder mountain. I am not willing to race 3:00 Sunday afternoon make it Saturday day or Night and I will be there. I personally think a night race would be awesome.
 
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