Passing off course while cutting a corner?

MTPyle

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I have been seeing some passes that I would never do myself and wondering if I am just too conservative?

This thread is not to question anyone or call people out. I just want to know what is acceptable and what is not.

This weekend at the Rage we were passed in the infield by a truck that went out of the course and cut the corner to pass us. He was faster for sure and would have passed anyway but I was really surprised at how he did it.

It reminded me of last years Rage when Robby Gordon passed a couple trucks by cutting a corner in the infield.

Do you guys think its OK to go off course to make a pass? even is that means you take a short cut and bypass a turn?

Again just trying to learn whats OK.

Mike
 
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Objectively, what would make for the the safer pass?
 

SpyRacing

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I mean if I saw an option to pass someone I was going to regardless and do it safely by cutting 10-20’ to the inside of a turn to allow room for the two of us I would. Also a lot of that has to do with how much momentum am I carrying jnto that turn compared to the guy im passing? If im going to be railing this turn and the guy im passing is essentially moving at the rate of a log going down river id take the inside, if I am barely reeling him in id stay on course. When it comes down to it its all about momentum and the situation.


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MTPyle

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I am all for safe passing and I personally move over as soon as possible. I figure if a truck is on my ass he is faster and I need to let him by

That being said when a guy from the same class is on my butt during maybe a area that I am a tad slower than I will make him work for it. I have held a guy off and ended up pulling away to never see him again. That to me is racing. If I catch a guy in my class that I am barely faster than I expect to have to work for it. I don’t expect him to just roll over.

But passing a guy in my class by cutting corners seems wrong. But if it’s OK I will start doing it.

I kind of get the sense that’s it’s OK for the top names to get away with but wonder if the new guy like myslwf does it what will happen?

And that video above does not seem that bad. That guy moved over when he had a good chance. At least that’s my opinion.

Mike
 

Robin Hood

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This has nothing to do with what is safer...the infield is basically short-course racing and if you go off course you should re-enter at the same location or not gain any advantage, i.e. track position, if entering down course. You pull that crap on me and you get your arse handed to you in the next corner.
 

CFreeLV

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Your not being too conservative. The infield is 3 cars wide and has option lanes. If he was faster than you I don't understand in jeopardizing the chance of penalty when he could have got by you clean the next turn. It's not like there was silt right after and if he didn't get by you he would eat your dust for the next 100 miles. Of all courses RAGE is the easiest place to make a clean safe pass. There are 3-4 lines on 90% of the course.

I have been seeing some passes that I would never do myself and wondering if I am just too conservative?

This thread is not to question anyone or call people out. I just want to know what is acceptable and what is not.

This weekend at the Rage we were passed in the infield by a truck that went out of the course and cut the corner to pass us. He was faster for sure and would have passed anyway but I was really surprised at how he did it.

It reminded me of last years Rage when Robby Gordon passed a couple trucks by cutting a corner in the infield.

Do you guys think its OK to go off course to make a pass? even is that means you take a short cut and bypass a turn?

Again just trying to learn whats OK.

Mike
 

SummerTime

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I watched exactly the pass your post is referring to and i know who it was. I was very surprised to see it happen the way it did. He could have a good reason for it (underestimated closing speed, etc.), or maybe it was just the easy option, who is to say. In this case its not a big deal, if you both were battling for position it would be a dirty move indeed.
 

MTPyle

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Yeah it was not a big deal for us. It just made me think maybe I don’t know what is OK. I want to be competitive and if the fast guys are doing stuff like this regularly than maybe I need to.

I was just going thru videos and saw this from an outside video and the in car camera.

Again not trying to call anyone out as it was not for position and we were slower.

It seems like the consensus is you really should stay in the track In the in field.

Mike
 

y2kbaja

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In regards to passing inside of a turn in open desert, the race organizations are closely monitored by BLM and cutting corners could result in the organization not getting race permits or more in the future.
 

Bro_Gill

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This above is important to learn and needs to be enforced. Cutting corners, whether passing or simply having time is simply asking for a revocation of a race permit down the road. The land management agency gives the promoter a corridor to work with and anytime a vehicle is outside that corridor, it places the future of racing in jeopardy. Stay on the course. With short course races, usually there is a race steward or competition board that makes decisions about folks who leave the course and what the penalty is. The berms around the edges of the track determine what is the course and leaving it for any reason other than a crash or the stewards orders to get around something on the course, it usually leads to a penalty or DQ. Passing like that has always been a NO. In this case, it would good to hear from SNORE for your education.
 

D-Munoz1472

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I also saw this pass in the in field and was surprised by it. That type of pass is cheating, he stepped out of the race line and bypassed the turn to get around you when he could have easily got around you in the next turn that had 2 lines. I'm not sure where they placed but that definitely jeopardized a possible win if 2nd place were to protest.

So for the question, in my opinion you should always stay in the race line and on course. Even when passing lap traffic or a slower vehicle. That's racing, you deal with obstacles. Look at other forms of racing... Supercross, Lucas Oil Off Road Racing Series, Nascar etc.. that have eyes on them at all times. If a racer goes off course and cuts a corner for an unfair advantage a penalty, black flag or even DQ is in order. Desert racing is harder to police being its an open desert with multiple race lines. But I am sure we have all seen Heli footage of a desert racer cutting a corner on the inside by 50 yards and shook our heads.
 

MTPyle

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Thats a good point. If I was second place to a guy that cut the course to get around someone I would be pissed.

I will keep driving conservative and not be tempted to follow these guys in their questionable tactics.

We knew we would not place in this race as we only had BITD engine and tires (plus we are new and not dialed in yet). I think the top 4-5 guys in 6100 were actually SCORE TT spec guys. We feel good about our results given what we had to work with and the fact that was our first race that we were ready for. This was our 4th race ever and the first 3 were scrambles and we were in survival mode. We have most of the major kinks worked out and are now focused on tweaking to be more competitive.

I think our Driving technique and pace his mostly solid. Just need some work on gearing and getting the power down. We are heavy which has its pros and cons. We looked thru all of our car footage and we actually did really well in corners and bumps. Just got beat on straight aways with acceleration. If we can get our gearing and power right I think we will do well.

Thanks for all the feedback and for confirming what we thought was appropriate.

Mike
 

Jangaard

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I might be OK with it as long as I was not passed while being held up by a car in front of me. Other than that, I wouldn't be happy if the guy did not walk away from me after this questionable pass. And if he did not drive away from me, he could expect me to pass him in the same manner.
 

MTPyle

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Is there a video of this in this thread or someplace else? Was it taken down? I'm not seeing one.
Dan,
I didn't post the video as that was not the intent of the thread. I was really just wanting to know if that behavior was allowed. being new to the racing scene we are trying to learn as much as possible of whats OK and whats not. We want to be competitive but not jack a$$'s

I have no issues with the driver that passed us in the in field. I am sure he knew it was not OK. or he had a good explanation. I don't care either way. If it was for position in my class I would have cared for sure.

Mike
 
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MTPyle

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Also as mentioned before I remember Robby Gordon doing the same thing last year at the Rage. He jumped out of the course and passed two trucks. I was surprised then and wondered if that was OK. There are no course markings on the infield so maybe it is just a suggestion? LOL

Obviously SNORE is OK with it. I understand its hard to police an entire course but it should be pretty easy to watch the infield. They had to know it happened and did nothing which in a way says to me its OK.

I also watched a truck come in the in field with flat tire. They went into the cold pits and got the flat changed. Came back on course like nothing happened. Pretty sure nothing happened to them either. SNORE said at the driver meeting that was not OK but they didn't enforce it. Not to slam SNORE but from my perspective they seemed more worried about upcoming elections and politics than enforcement. Which to be fair I think a lot of racing organizations are that way.

But it seems like we all agree here that its not OK to go off course in the infield to pass or go to cold pits to change tire.

Mike
 
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D-Munoz1472

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Not bashing anyone, just providing material for the discussion at hand.

Go to 0.25 for the 2017 RG pass

Go to 5.50 for the pass on the OP The full video is pretty awesome if you have time to watch.
 

MTPyle

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OK well... I didn't think there was other video of it. LOL

You can see he had to check up when he got to us, we were slower for sure. I drove the first day and my Son Connor drive on Sunday. So that was not me when he passed our truck. Just saying HEHE. Not that he wouldn't have passed me. He was flat out fast.

My 15 yr old Son Carson Co drove both days.

And the RG event seemed worse from memory. But he still clearly went off course and gained positions by not hitting obstacles.

Mike
 
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dan200

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Dan,
I didn't post the video as that was not the intent of the thread. I was really just wanting to know if that behavior was allowed. being new to the racing scene we are trying to learn as much as possible of whats OK and whats not. We want to be competitive but not jack a$$'s

I have no issues with the driver that passed us in the in field. I am sure he knew it was not OK. or he had a good explanation. I don't care either way. If it was for position in my class I would have cared for sure.

Mike
Ah, I get it now.

I thought that there was discussion of a video that everyone had seen and then you or whoever went back and deleted it. I understand why you held back from posting one.
 

KTB Racing

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I came into that same corner several times where i had to check up for slower vehicles and never once considered taking a line like that. But that could also be because Im only on 35” tires and leaf springs so my truck wouldnt take it that well lol. I would definitely be upset if I lost aposition or if that was a factor in the outcome of the race. IMO the only reason that would be ok is if the course is blocked by broken/stuck vehicles.
 
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