Solar Farms

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I am a big supporter of solar energy when it's the roof of your house. This allows individuals to take responsibility for the energy that they are consuming and has little impact on the environment.

Anybody who knows anything about the losses that occur in transferring power via wires understands the basic idea that the closer to power source this less loss you have.

These large solar farms in the middle of the beautiful desert have always bothered me. Especially when they get to drop them into environmentally sensitive areas like the one at state line.

It also seem like these facilities are new way to scam tax payers and investors out of money.

I am interested in hearing more information on the value of these solar farms and if they are a viable power solution. Here are a couple of articles backing up my opinion.

Behind the collapse of SunEdison, a solar supernova

Giant Ivanpah solar plant south of Las Vegas falls short

Ivanpah Solar Plant May Be Forced to Shut Down
 

BigBlue&Goldie

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These scars on the landscape wouldn't exist if it wasn't for the b.s. tax incentives and grants. Simply put, 99.99% of people in that industry don't give a damn about clean energy, they care about milking the system. The only thing worse than a sea of solar panels is a sea of windmills. Horrible.
 

J Prich

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Probably already water under the bridge mostly but the writing was on the wall in these deals 10+ years ago when the BLM was doing scoping meetings to take public input. They'd have representatives from the energy companies on hand to answer questions and it was fairly clear that the meetings were only occuring as a formality, a required part of the process. The feedback wasn't important, they just needed to check the square to show that they "accepted" public input.

Now it's come to fruition with "farms" built. There is a significant body of evidence documenting the negative consequences of the developments AND the overstated production value. But you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube...
 

Slippery P

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Ivanpah is a complete failure, tear it down and get it out of our desert. It has been bought and paid for with tax payers money twice over. Absolutely disgusting being owned by NRG and Google.
 

Bdub 1020

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Yeah I went to several meetings with groups of racers. Seemed like SNORE and MIRAN were the only ones that cared or maybe thought we could fight these rich Libtards. You could definitely tell that no matter how many people were against this with facts showing these solar farms would end up being negative they did not care. BLM was bought and paid and the meetings were just that Prich. Part of the process to move forward. Now coming into Stateline or Into Boulder (Eldorado Valley) is ruined for ever. Ugly and devastated wildlife. The BLM needs to be abolished and the people behind these solar farms arrested for fraud and misuse of taxpayers dollars.
 

Bro_Gill

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First, I am not sure the comment about environmentally sensitive areas like that at Stateline is relevant. I don't think it is any more sensitive than any other section of desert out there unless you want to include the freeway, golf course, roller coaster, outlet center, etc... in that conversation as well. Environmentalists say WE are the scourge of the desert destroying it, and use terms like 'sensitive' and 'endangered' to sucker in the public into thinking that the desert is almost gone and we have to save the last little fragments of it from people like us! That isn't the case, is it? There are millions and millions of acres of desert protected, never to be raced on, never to be used for solar production, etc... The environmentalists have us right where they want us, fighting with the power industry, the military, the mineral industry, etc... over the small scraps left. Are the financial politics behind these projects offensive? Yes, but the idea is not something we should be fighting against. If it affects a promoters ability to hold an event in an area that traditionally has been used for decades, that is something entirely different, but trying to play the 'ugly environmental disaster' card when our sport shares the same page withe group that is trying to stop out sport is playing Russian roulette. Those panels could have been built somewhere else. Yes. But we can race somewhere else too. That should be our goal for the sport. No loss of acreage, even ifit means moving to another location to race. The argument should be no more protected areas, we have enough.
 

J Prich

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First, I am not sure the comment about environmentally sensitive areas like that at Stateline is relevant. I don't think it is any more sensitive than any other section of desert out there unless you want to include the freeway, golf course, roller coaster, outlet center, etc... in that conversation as well. Environmentalists say WE are the scourge of the desert destroying it, and use terms like 'sensitive' and 'endangered' to sucker in the public into thinking that the desert is almost gone and we have to save the last little fragments of it from people like us! That isn't the case, is it? There are millions and millions of acres of desert protected, never to be raced on, never to be used for solar production, etc... The environmentalists have us right where they want us, fighting with the power industry, the military, the mineral industry, etc... over the small scraps left. Are the financial politics behind these projects offensive? Yes, but the idea is not something we should be fighting against. If it affects a promoters ability to hold an event in an area that traditionally has been used for decades, that is something entirely different, but trying to play the 'ugly environmental disaster' card when our sport shares the same page withe group that is trying to stop out sport is playing Russian roulette. Those panels could have been built somewhere else. Yes. But we can race somewhere else too. That should be our goal for the sport. No loss of acreage, even ifit means moving to another location to race. The argument should be no more protected areas, we have enough.
Without putting words in Matt's mouth I think the intent and point he was making is that primarily the problem here is that solar "farms" are inherently not green. The reasonable, rational solution is now and has always been rooftop solar. The fact that solar farms are built on land that was previously off limits because it was too sensitive is evidence that the whole thing is a scam but it's not the primary point.

The main point here, to me at least, is that roof top solar is the only REAL green energy currently on the market and everything else is just a silly scam.
 

BigBlue&Goldie

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I would love to see the data on how much of our tax dollars have been put into these solar farms vs what private enterprise has invested. I'm willing to bet there isn't a solar farm in America that can be built and operated to produce a profit without government funds. I'm also willing to bet Chinese manufacturers made more money off these projects than American companies did. Without getting political, it's about damn time we get somebody in office who will put an end to this mess.
 

BigBlue&Goldie

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The main point here, to me at least, is that roof top solar is the only REAL green energy currently on the market and everything else is just a silly scam.
I agree, but rooftop solar is still a tax payer funded sham as well. There is a large solar contractor in California that gave a talk detailing out how he built a storage facility and covered it in solar panels; a $10mm project that cost him $3mm out of pocket due to the incentives.

Also, the public utilities have started talking about imposing a tax/fee for solar users as they aren't contributing their "fair" share of the costs to maintain the grid. On one hand they are giving away money and on the other they are taking it......it's all about who bought what politician.
 

J Burleson

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It doesn't matter who you put in office. A (neo) liberal will keep pushing this forward in the name of the environment and as a bonus, the economy. A conservative will keep pushing this forward in the name of the economy and as a bonus, the environment. But at the end of the day, it's all about green in the pockets, not green on the trees. There is WAAY to much new industry created around this shite for anybody to stop and think logically about it.
whats also super awesome is that part of the gov. Subsidized loans for these projects is that the companies taking the "loans" aren't responsible for decommission. So when they decide to call it a day, they just take the money and walk. Like it never even happened.
 

Bro_Gill

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" The fact that solar farms are built on land that was previously off limits because it was too sensitive is evidence that the whole thing is a scam but it's not the primary point. "


This IS the point. How many homes are built on land that was off limits to dirt bike riding around Southern California that used to be open to riding until the environmentalists won their initial blow in 1973 that started the whole land closure craze? Any land that can be developed for solar down the road can surely have a few dirt bikes ride on it today. That should be the point. He is making the wrong argument. Politics aside, Hydro electric is the best energy source out there, but that is being reduced. Nuclear is next and that is impossible to build nowadays. Next is fossil fuels and that is currently under attack. See the pattern? Their end game is caves and mud huts, no cars, no lights, just survival. That is how they see it as 'right' with nature. From steaks and burgers to lights and dirt bikes, they want to end it all.
 

Mark Newhan

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Solar power is a good idea to add capacity to the grid. It doesn't work in all areas due to weather patterns. Solar isn't the answer to our power requirements. It isn't a reliable alternative due to the fact that that is only produces power half the day and produces poor amounts of power in cloudy conditions.

There is a lot of people that back the idea of closing all nuclear power plants, such as they did with San Onofre. I, like many other people, am tired of all of the rushing to force change by claiming that if we don't act right this minute, the earth is doomed. I'd be more in lock step if we focused on the real issue that mankind might be swinging in the balance, since this planet will shead mankind like it did with dinosaurs.
 

DanMcMillin

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A great watch if you have the time. Talks about Manoj Bhargava (founder of 5 Hour Energy) and his mission to making the world a better place. Maybe off topic for this solar debate, but still an interesting piece.

 

green787

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Off roading is growing exponentially as a sport and hobby.... Regulation is a natural phenomenon of growth.... The people crying wolf can't produce one picture of any hippy libtards protesting at our races, or at off road shows....
I'm too stupid to understand why we can't race around these solar plants.....???? Please explain......
OH, and thank God there's people like me in this sport that will fight for all inclusiveness.....
 
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Mark Newhan

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Off roading is growing exponentially as a sport and hobby.... Regulation is a natural phenomenon of growth.... The people crying wolf can't produce one picture of any hippy libtards protesting at our races, or at off road shows....
I'm too stupid to understand why we can't race around these solar plants.....???? Please explain......
OH, and thank God there's people like me in this sport that will fight for all inclusiveness.....
While that may be true that they aren't protesting at the races, I've seen plenty of them giving plenty of dirty looks armed with cameras.

The hypocracy is overwhelming. For example, just today the California head of the Ku Klux Clan came out and endorsed Hillary, I'm hearing pins drop. Remember just a few weeks David Duke Endorsed Trump? It was a media fire storm...

More hypocracy...
 

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Sheaco

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The people crying wolf can't produce one picture of any hippy libtards protesting at our races, or at off road shows....

lmao, You can't see the digital bread lines either.
 

green787

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While that may be true that they aren't protesting at the races, I've seen plenty of them giving plenty of dirty looks armed with cameras.

The hypocracy is overwhelming. For example, just today the California head of the Ku Klux Clan came out and endorsed Hillary, I'm hearing pins drop. Remember just a few weeks David Duke Endorsed Trump? It was a media fire storm...

More hypocracy...
Those aren't dirty looks, those are looks of shock and awe and a touch of envy.... You can't tell, that they are digging it, going by at 100mph.... Their cell phones are hiding their faces....
The KKK SHOULD endorse Hillary.... Who's from the South???....The Donald LOVES foreigners.......
Your dead bird IS plastered all over the internet... You just did it....
Why can't we race AROUND the Solar Farms....???
 
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