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The "Official" Dakar 2019 Thread

Dirty Harry

Well-Known Member
For sure. A TT would get crushed. I just meant some of the geometry setups. RG criticized the first version of the Peugeot pretty sternly. That thing bucked terribly. The H3 was far superior to anything out there(other than Schlessler buggy), but couldn't win because of the power regs.
It wasn't "far superior" though. I vividly remember watching RG come through a rough patch of the course in Chile a few years ago and passing a Mini and the locals going ape ****, but then as Robby climbed a hill and was hooning with the rear tires spinning the Mini just passed back in front of him. Again, the course doesn't favor long travel vehicles (particularly in the last few years when they have not gone to the Atacama in Chile).

Everyone used to say 2WD was a disadvantage, gas was a disadvantage. Then Peugeot came in and cleaned house with a 2WD that was right at the limits for weight. They also spent easily 10x what RG spends and stacked the field with the best drivers and navigators to ensure victory. The fact that he is the underdog is what makes rooting for Robby so appealing, but lets not pretend that he has the best vehicle/team/navigator in rally raid.
 

Bricoop

Well-Known Member
It wasn't "far superior" though. I vividly remember watching RG come through a rough patch of the course in Chile a few years ago and passing a Mini and the locals going ape ****, but then as Robby climbed a hill and was hooning with the rear tires spinning the Mini just passed back in front of him. Again, the course doesn't favor long travel vehicles (particularly in the last few years when they have not gone to the Atacama in Chile).

Everyone used to say 2WD was a disadvantage, gas was a disadvantage. Then Peugeot came in and cleaned house with a 2WD that was right at the limits for weight. They also spent easily 10x what RG spends and stacked the field with the best drivers and navigators to ensure victory. The fact that he is the underdog is what makes rooting for Robby so appealing, but lets not pretend that he has the best vehicle/team/navigator in rally raid.
I’d be interested in seeing that video. You sure it wasn’t a power issue?
Didn’t the H3 come back and do extremely well in a Score or BITD event in 2009ish? The reason I ask is because a short travel car wouldn’t have a chance here and it surprises me to hear a mini handled the rough stuff better than it did.
 

Bricoop

Well-Known Member
It was 2006 Parker the H3 won and that thing was a freaking pig. The '09 Hummer was a lot better truck. I'm still sticking by my statement that the suspension on the H3 was far superior in the rough to any of the 4WDs. :D But it was too slow with the restrictor.
 
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Dirty Harry

Well-Known Member
I’d be interested in seeing that video. You sure it wasn’t a power issue?
I didn't shoot any video of it unfortunately. RG passed the Mini in the rough, but as soon as they started climbing a loose hill the Mini just passed him back.

It was 2006 Parker the H3 won and that thing was a freaking pig. The '09 Hummer was a lot better truck. I'm still sticking by my statement that the suspension on the H3 was far superior in the rough to any of the 4WDs. :D But it was too slow with the restrictor.
I agree that the H3 is better than basically anything at Dakar in the rough, I just don't think that there is enough rough to make it the right tool for the job at hand.
 

Bricoop

Well-Known Member
Nasser was destroying people in his Hummer. Destroying belts too of course.


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Yea, RG constantly talked about cruising, those iqueque videos are ridiculous. Nasser was downshifting too aggressively
I didn't shoot any video of it unfortunately. RG passed the Mini in the rough, but as soon as they started climbing a loose hill the Mini just passed him back.



I agree that the H3 is better than basically anything at Dakar in the rough, I just don't think that there is enough rough to make it the right tool for the job at hand.
For sure. Dakar has lost its heart. Drivers helicoptering to hotels in the evening, running too many fire roads, etc etc. the guys from decades past are the real warriors. The new Dakar is closer to F1 than Baja.

Back to the superiority of the H3-after RG got DQ’d for “cheating” he beat everyone in the next stage by 15:18. That would have been the largest margin of victory of any Dakar stage that year. Actually 2x the difference of the next closest stage. Not to mention it wasn’t nearly as long as some of the other stages.
 

Dirty Harry

Well-Known Member
Back to the superiority of the H3-after RG got DQ’d for “cheating” he beat everyone in the next stage by 15:18. That would have been the largest margin of victory of any Dakar stage that year. Actually 2x the difference of the next closest stage. Not to mention it wasn’t nearly as long as some of the other stages.
And Uncle Rico could throw a football over the mountains. But in the end all anyone remembers is who won the Rally.
 

Bricoop

Well-Known Member
A few comparisons:
Peugeot 3008DKR vs Speedcat77
Power 340HP vs 240HP
Tire Size 37" vs 32"
Weight unknown (min 3500lbs) vs 2,000lbs (estimated) (both without drivers)
Wheel Travel 18" vs 23" (Though it appears UTVs are limited to 20", will need to research more)
Drive Wheels 2x4 vs 4x4
Assuming the Peugeot hits minimum weight with 400lbs of drivers and equipment, vs 450lbs for the wildcat (sorry RG) You've got a power to weight of 0.087 vs 0.098

Gonna be interesting for sure
 

spalind

Well-Known Member
I like the idea of finally using the Dakar vehicle at the various Baja and BITD events...RG never (rarely? Yes, I know he ran it occasionally but usually that was a one off, after returning from Dakar, not as a regimented plan for testing) used the Dakar vehicle in those events as he was always looking for the OA win in his TT in those events...Now? His Baja legacy is established, no overwhelming need to look for OA TT wins and can use the SSV in these events and get more realworld testing done.
 

BajaFand

Well-Known Member
I like the idea of finally using the Dakar vehicle at the various Baja and BITD events...RG never (rarely? Yes, I know he ran it occasionally but usually that was a one off, after returning from Dakar, not as a regimented plan for testing) used the Dakar vehicle in those events as he was always looking for the OA win in his TT in those events...Now? His Baja legacy is established, no overwhelming need to look for OA TT wins and can use the SSV in these events and get more realworld testing done.
You’re crazy if you think he’s not racing the TT at the 1000. He will get some time in the Cats when the TT finishes or breaks or he lets someone else take the wheel. Make no mistake, the overall win is his priority.


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Bricoop

Well-Known Member
Romano said they’re bringing an N/A and a Turbo to the 1000. RG is 100% running his TT at the 1000.

I think the new TT he’s building will be a 4x4 Dakar, TT hybrid. I could even see it being similar to a large SxS. TT is coming to the 1K, who knows when the new TT build will start.
 

GEO_DXB

Well-Known Member
Martin Prokop stays in Morocco after the finish of Rally Maroc for further tests of his F150-bodied car before the Dakar start. Playing in the dunes as we speak so to say.

Looks like there will be 2 additional Peugeots of Easy Rally Team - Besson and one more for someone to rent(???). Serradori in his buggy seems to be going as well and has built another vehicle for a team of 2 cars. Han Wei was clearly in Morocco as prep for Dakar (ok, thats my thinking only for now). So 2WD cars are getting ready to go to the dunes in Dakar...
 

Short Bus

Well-Known Member
A few comparisons:
Peugeot 3008DKR vs Speedcat77
Power 340HP vs 240HP
Tire Size 37" vs 32"
Weight unknown (min 3500lbs) vs 2,000lbs (estimated) (both without drivers)
Wheel Travel 18" vs 23" (Though it appears UTVs are limited to 20", will need to research more)
Drive Wheels 2x4 vs 4x4
Assuming the Peugeot hits minimum weight with 400lbs of drivers and equipment, vs 450lbs for the wildcat (sorry RG) You've got a power to weight of 0.087 vs 0.098

Gonna be interesting for sure
The 2018 FIA regs do not allow turbocharged T3 cars. The 2019 proposed(?) regs allow turbocharging, but require intake restrictors on turbo UTVs. That 240hp number would get cut down.

From the Draft 2019 FIA Regulation. Appendix J - Article 286A - Specific regulations for T3 Series Cross-Country Cars:

7.13.2 All supercharged engines must be fitted with an air restrictor.
All the air necessary for feeding the engine must pass through this
restrictor/these restrictors, which must comply with Article 284‐6.1,
except for its internal diameter which is defined by Article 9.2.4 of
the CROSS‐COUNTRY RALLY GENERAL PRESCRIPTIONS.
| Federation Internationale de l'Automobile
 
This new ford truck for under 10l class could be interesting to watch. Looks lot more sporter than your traditional shape cabs from DAF,MAN& Scania in the T4 class.
 
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