Why not turbo?

McCredie A

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The Danzio Twin Turbo Trophy Truck engine is a very very powerful yet reliable package, it more than proved its self while Josh ran it. It really is what these new era 4wd truck need. If a couple top teams chose to go down that road, the Big block craze would vanish much like the SBC 8 stack has over the last 2 years.

Did Dale build an AWD with a twin turbo Toyota? I thought you guys were involved in that one as well. Whatever happened to it?
 

Bro_Gill

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I think simplicity and power band are why. It would take some pretty crazy mechaneering to get a series type turbo motor in a small package that would create the torque a simple big inch motor does. Hearing some crazy numbers on torque converters too, like 4200 rpms to come in. Who needs cooling???
 

Slippery P

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Did Dale build an AWD with a twin turbo Toyota? I thought you guys were involved in that one as well. Whatever happened to it?
Yes, it was a Triad NASCAR/pro4 engine we turbocharged for him. The timing belt would not live past 150 miles.

We then built him our SBC turbo package and no more problems. That truck just went to Australia.
 

Slippery P

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Did Dale build an AWD with a twin turbo Toyota? I thought you guys were involved in that one as well. Whatever happened to it?
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The Triad was an awesome piece of engineering, unfortunately it was a horrible idea that Dale couldn’t be talked out of at the time. That engine design was not good for what we do in this sport.
 

Slippery P

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Danny42

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Limited displacement rules in Australia (6lt V8 - 3.5L Turbo) have led us to running turbo motors, took a while to work out the right formulas and to get longevity out of the motors but they are pretty bulletproof now. A well built 3.5lt turbo will see 800-900Hp, below is my class 1 Alumi Craft with a built Nissan VR38 (out of the GTR but with a 3.5 crank). I have a 4wd one with the same engine config getting built at Alumi Craft now, looking forward to seeing how it compares.

IMG_2369.JPG
IMG_2365.JPG
 

Slippery P

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@Danny42 thats a great looking car, has to be a blast to drive.
 
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partybarge_pilot

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View attachment 221524
Every inch of real estate was used up in the TTTT.

And there is the main drawback. By the time you package all the turbos and coolers needed to make reliable power there isn't much in the way of weight savings. Add in the extra cost and the added potential for things to break, NA motors will still be a viable option for a while.
 

Slippery P

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Agreed, although more of a deterrent, that being said it’s worth it.
 

green787

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Score's rulebook reads:

CR 32 FORCED INDUCTION
Forced induction is allowed for all gasoline and diesel engines. (Effective 1/1/2019)
No restriction on turbo size or manufacture.
No restriction on air intake size.

I have no information on previous editions of the rules.

My guess on why it's not widespread? Most racing engines that are built with turbos are developed with limited displacements in mind. There's more, easier power available quicker from just upgrading existing NA designs. We know that the Herbst guys are sourcing high-power stuff from NASCAR teams, and that seems like it's a pretty easy development compared to designing a brand-new turbo system that can withstand the kind of pressure a high-CID engine that is battered around the desert for 800-1100 miles. Just my guess, though.

Didn't VW run a version of Audi's Le Mans Turbodiesel a decade or so ago?
You must be a moron..... I don't care what you think..... Don't reply to my comments......
 

mxben

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Limited displacement rules in Australia (6lt V8 - 3.5L Turbo) have led us to running turbo motors, took a while to work out the right formulas and to get longevity out of the motors but they are pretty bulletproof now. A well built 3.5lt turbo will see 800-900Hp, below is my class 1 Alumi Craft with a built Nissan VR38 (out of the GTR but with a 3.5 crank). I have a 4wd one with the same engine config getting built at Alumi Craft now, looking forward to seeing how it compares.

View attachment 221522View attachment 221523

SCWHING
 

MTPyle

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Pretty sure they just made Superchargers legal a year or so ago also. Not sure why there is no SC engines. Would have instant power response and simple package.

somebody needs to do it.
Mike
 

Slippery P

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Pretty sure they just made Superchargers legal a year or so ago also. Not sure why there is no SC engines. Would have instant power response and simple package.

somebody needs to do it.
Mike
There are a lot of disadvantages to a supercharger versus a twin turbo set up. Really the only advantage is like you stated instant power, no lag, they make a lot of torque right out of the gate. That being said the heat soak is horrible, they are driven off the crank, so you are using power to make power. The belt is another issue, in our environment they eat belts (think a race like the mint where you are plowing gravel in the big holes) those rocks would be going right into the belt. Then there is the issue of belt slip due to the load from the blower. Also in the upper RPM levels they become a massive intake restriction and the engine lays over, unless of course to avoid that you install a massive blower which then There goes your packaging. The lag everyone refers to with turbos, and main ignorant excuse for a disadvantage argument, is a thing of the past with the advancement in Motorsports electronics.
 
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Bricoop

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There are a lot of disadvantages to a supercharger versus a twin turbo set up. Really the only advantage is like you stated instant power, no lag, they make a lot of torque right out of the gate. That being said the heat soak is horrible, they are driven off the crank, so you are using power to make power. The belt is another issue, in our environment they eat belts (think a race like the mint where you are plowing gravel in the big holes) those rocks would be going right into the belt. Then there is the issue of belt slip due to the load from the blower. Also in the upper RPM levels they become a massive intake restriction and the engine lays over, unless of course to avoid that you install a massive blower which then There goes your packaging. The lag everyone refers to with turbos, and main ignorant excuse for a disadvantage argument, is a thing of the past with the advancement in Motorsports electronics.
Have you guys explored using different sized turbos to reduce the lag (ie different sized turbos on the same engine)?
 

Slippery P

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Have you guys explored using different sized turbos to reduce the lag (ie different sized turbos on the same engine)?
You would need to compound them, so no, mainly due to packaging. We do how ever use/mismatch different size exhaust and compressor wheels and housings, as well as full ECU waste gate control, and anti-lag software. This combined with boost by gear settings allows you to keep lag to a minimum if not eliminate it all together.
 
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