On Topic Rugged Radios

[bajafox]

Saw this on Fishgistics and it's starting to make the rounds on Facebook

https://docs.fcc.gov/public/attachments/DA-20-1395A1.pdf?fbclid=IwAR3tOE-qz1iEpoLQYhdzQdbrZm7L3a-Ha3ecO2bU6HQsSpFUAKgtAdaMnAA

 

[pdailey]

LOL. PCI for life.

 

[dan200]

 

[MTPyle]

I always wondered how Rugged and PCI get away with selling pro level radios that require a FCC license to people that do not have the license.

I don't think its just a Rugged issue, I think PCI is also going against the laws.

I think all these UTV's and recreation guys playing on these frequencies have made it a big enough problem for the FCC to deal with. Many channels that come on stock race radios are used by commercial operators that have the license to operate on those channels. Imagine you have your business using a channel and then some dudes in a UTV are on your channel, I would me pissed.

For the record we applied and get the license to use the frequency we use. Ours is a shared and open channel but you still need to have the license to legally operate on it. You guys may remember I had a thread about it and got all sorts of crap from the RDC Forum for wanting to follow the rules. LOL

Mike

 

[dan200]

PCI didn't put fake FCC ID's on radios, rebadge them in blue, claim them as their own device and then sell them to people all over the country who could go do whatever they wanted to with them. The FCC has been sending Rugged warnings since 2017. That is not an issue with PCI. They actually have never had an FCC warning.

Pissed off the HAM radio operators I bet.

 

[bajafox]

I was looking at their handheld radio sets over Black Friday. I use a PCI radio in my chase truck but wanted to get a pair of handhelds, sometimes I have people following me without radios and wanted a pair of handhelds that I could keep with me to lend out or just keep on me when I'm not near my truck.

Looks like the ones I was looking at are still on their website.

 

[J Prich]

I always wondered how Rugged and PCI get away with selling pro level radios that require a FCC license to people that do not have the license.

I don't think its just a Rugged issue, I think PCI is also going against the laws.

I think all these UTV's and recreation guys playing on these frequencies have made it a big enough problem for the FCC to deal with. Many channels that come on stock race radios are used by commercial operators that have the license to operate on those channels. Imagine you have your business using a channel and then some dudes in a UTV are on your channel, I would me pissed.

For the record we applied and get the license to use the frequency we use. Ours is a shared and open channel but you still need to have the license to legally operate on it. You guys may remember I had a thread about it and got all sorts of crap from the RDC Forum for wanting to follow the rules. LOL

Mike

As Dan already pointed out, I don't think that's the same issue. The issue here wasn't about frequency use, it was about FCC certification of the actual devices Rugged is selling.

 

[SMS81]

From the citation;
6. Rugged Radios acknowledged that it marketed each of the six models identified in the LOI.11 Specifically, it began marketing the RH5R-V2 in February 2014, RM25R in November 2015, RM60-V in June 2016, RM-50R in July 2016, RM25R-WP in March 2017, and RM100 in May 2017.12 Rugged Radios acknowledged that all six models were “sold with the capability of being face programmable to allow a user to enter new operating frequencies” and that the associated manufacturer or supplier delivered the radio to the Company with this capability.13 The Company also identified the frequencies that it pre-programmed into each model prior to sale.14


Looks like they are guilty of selling programable radios, and admitted to it. I think everyone gets their radios programed to run a certain frequency without a license from the fcc. So I guess we are all guilty. Just more regulations from the govt on us. BS!!

 

[MTPyle]

Oh dang. I didn’t read it, just figured it was a frequency usage issue. Which both Rugged and PCI have problems with.

that’s super bad if Rugged was doing that with the certs. That could be the end of them. The FCC don’t play.

I guess I should wait 24 hours to post. LOL. But then I would never post. But maybe that was JerryB’s plan. Hehe.

Mike

 

[dan200]

Oh dang. I didn’t read it, just figured it was a frequency usage issue. Which both Rugged and PCI have problems with.

that’s super bad if Rugged was doing that with the certs. That could be the end of them. The FCC don’t play.

I guess I should wait 24 hours to post. LOL. But then I would never post. But maybe that was JerryB’s plan. Hehe.

Mike

did you prerun the "rage at the tree bar" course yet? Because ya arent famous enough to do that.

 

[JerryB]

Oh dang. I didn’t read it, just figured it was a frequency usage issue. Which both Rugged and PCI have problems with.

that’s super bad if Rugged was doing that with the certs. That could be the end of them. The FCC don’t play.

I guess I should wait 24 hours to post. LOL. But then I would never post. But maybe that was JerryB’s plan. Hehe.

Mike

24 hour rule Mike.......24 hours!

 

[NIKAL]

Maybe I’m wrong, but I think part of the issue could be these are Commercial Band radios, and you need to be FCC licensed to program & sell, or use these frequencies. But also the Rugged radios have programmed in them the GMRS frequencies, which are like CB and Walkie Talkie channels. (Channels 1,2,3 etc..). Those style radios are not able to be programmed by the user. I don’t think you are allowed to use those channels on a Commercial Band radio due to the Wattage output?

Years ago a friend of mines dad was a big Ham Radio guy, and he was helping us with antennas and he commented about why we had GMRS channels on our chase radios.

I would bet Rugged will have to pay a fine, do some FCC licensing ($Fees) and maybe only be able to program licensed channels in the radios they sell. But that would not stop the consumer from programming anything they wanted in them. Rugged just could not do it.

 

[ekozy39]

All the Rugged radio are available on Amazon under their Chinese name. Even PCI started selling the BaoFengs haha.. I have 5-6 of the Baofengs that i use for exactly what someone mentioned above, i loan them to volunteers and for $15 I'm not crying if it doesn;'t come back.. The Icoms on the other hand.. LOL

 

[usmcgunrock]

Rugged has been selling the rebranded cheap Chinese radios for years. They change the color, put their name on it, and upsell it for $100 or more. Why do you think they are always having sales? Or have so much money for all of their company toys. As for the FCC thing from a sellers point there is a few things they are doing wrong. One is some of those radios listed could transmit on all bands even CB at high watts. Certain bands can only have a certain watt max. Second is some of the radios where illegal to import into the USA no matter how they were used. Third was they were selling them with no programming restriction (user key in programable).

So were PCI is legal is they are preprogramming the radios in the business class band which is a gray area as to end user needing a license. To reprogram PCI radios you need hardware and software which takes it out of PCI hands legally. They also only sell commercial grade radios which is why they have much simpler user interfaces. Police, fire, trucking, ect do not need many buttons other then going to preprogrammed channels.

Then you have the hobby grade radios which you can buy at places like Ham Radio Outlet. Those are sold with hardware inside the radio that restricts you to certain radio bands. Making them legal to have user button programmable.

 

[Slippery P]

You know who else doesnt have these issues?
Palomar Communications, go give Chuck Hovey some love!

 

[snoreracer]

The VHF business band radios that are mostly used in desert racing needs to be FCC type 90 certified. That means the end user can not adjust the frequency just change a preset channel. The commercial radios that are type 90 accepted have more filters and less adjacent channel interference than Ham radios that you can self program and you should only use type 90 FCC certified radios so you do not interfere with local users and other race teams

 

[usmcgunrock]

The commercial radios that are type 90 accepted have more filters and less adjacent channel interference than Ham radios that you can self program and you should only use type 90 FCC certified radios so you do not interfere with local users and other race teams

That is the whole narrow band/ wide band thing right?

 

[steveG]

I don't think its just a Rugged issue, I think PCI is also going against the laws.

You’re absolutely right about this. The FCC has acknowledged (to me, on a few occasions) they are fully aware that desert racing (and the recreational crowd that has followed in its footsteps) has been pirating commercial band (Part 90) for 30-plus years. And, they are watching the industry as a whole. This almost came crashing down on the off-road industry at KOH a few years ago. This is part of what drove us to license lots of frequencies that cover our customers while using our radios… as of October 2018, we have a massive frequency license that protects our customers (to a limit, of course). The goal was, and continues to be, to protect the industry. Businesses operating in this space should be careful and do all they can to make themselves compliant before the FCC comes down on the entire desert scene.

Yes. We were issued at citation and, yes. We knew it was coming. We’ve been working closely with the FCC since the first inquiry and are very active in maintaining compliance… so, to those that are interested, we are compliant, well-stocked and ready to ship. To those that aren’t interested… well, that’s ok, too!

I don’t visit RDC much any more, so if anyone has any questions, comments, or just wants to blast me over the phone instead of here on the forum, I’d love to talk. 805-541-1696.

Oh. And to the comment about that’s why rugged “have so much money for all of their company toys”, I challenge you to find a business owner that reinvests more money back into a company that supports so many employees and their families.

 

[SMS81]

You’re absolutely right about this. The FCC has acknowledged (to me, on a few occasions) they are fully aware that desert racing (and the recreational crowd that has followed in its footsteps) has been pirating commercial band (Part 90) for 30-plus years. And, they are watching the industry as a whole. This almost came crashing down on the off-road industry at KOH a few years ago. This is part of what drove us to license lots of frequencies that cover our customers while using our radios… as of October 2018, we have a massive frequency license that protects our customers (to a limit, of course). The goal was, and continues to be, to protect the industry. Businesses operating in this space should be careful and do all they can to make themselves compliant before the FCC comes down on the entire desert scene.

Yes. We were issued at citation and, yes. We knew it was coming. We’ve been working closely with the FCC since the first inquiry and are very active in maintaining compliance… so, to those that are interested, we are compliant, well-stocked and ready to ship. To those that aren’t interested… well, that’s ok, too!

I don’t visit RDC much any more, so if anyone has any questions, comments, or just wants to blast me over the phone instead of here on the forum, I’d love to talk. 805-541-1696.

Oh. And to the comment about that’s why rugged “have so much money for all of their company toys”, I challenge you to find a business owner that reinvests more money back into a company that supports so many employees and their families.

Thank you for supporting the desert community!

 

[usmcgunrock]

Oh. And to the comment about that’s why rugged “have so much money for all of their company toys”, I challenge you to find a business owner that reinvests more money back into a company that supports so many employees and their families.

Hey Steve I will take that challenge. Know a few who do. But they are in the manufacturing industry which tend to be very far from the public line light.

What’s your stake in the company? Sales/service?

Maybe you could answer why is there such a huge mark up on the rugged rebranded radios that are marketed to the offroad community?